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kenpokis
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Quote kenpokis Replybullet Posted: 16 March 2010 at 1:01pm
28.1: How about something like the evil king has captured wilbot's family and are now enslaved by the king in the process of industrialization of the world. I don't think something cliche is really going to affect the overall feel of the game.

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Quote Ninja Crow Replybullet Posted: 16 March 2010 at 2:04pm
@ Kenpokis: Industrialisation is a good theme, which we can keep open. I don't know if we know enough about Wilbot yet to decide if he'd have a family or whatever, but if that can match whatever theme is decided best suits the game (such as robotiness), then it'll be fun to discuss. 'King' may not be a 'roboty' enough term for the game's theme, and would probably need some tweaking, but it's a reasonable direction to pursue.

And it is possible that if there is an antagonist he/it/they should probably be related to the final boss in some way (perhaps its master, perhaps the boss itself).

For me, I find it essential to reason through a set of core questions about plot and theme before committing too strongly to any particular story ideas, and one way we can be sure that any of the ideas we choose to go with are the best (and that we haven't left out any useful alternatives) is to try a creativity exercise:

For you and TRH (or anyone reading this thread), if you want to answer the first story question (#28.1: "Should there be an antagonist?") with a 'yes!' then please list at least three possible types of antagonist (from kings to criminals, from dinos to dragons, from thieves to thingumies - just whatever you like) as a way to loosen up the story gears, and have some fun! I'll add a few suggestions, too, if you guys decide the answer is yes - but we shouldn't choose anything until all the rest of the story questions have been answered (things once thought decided have a bad habit of needing revision later once other decisions are made that change things that weren't thought about yet, and so on).

So don't worry about having to settle for something cliche - just open the imagination floodgates on one easy question at a time and keep those good ideas coming!

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Quote Ruban Replybullet Posted: 16 March 2010 at 2:12pm
Well, just a stab... Wilbot's in some sort of virtual reality or computer, and he need to go around and get rid of a virus in it. Fits with the look of it IMO.

My suggestion would be to keep the story simple.

17.4 Palette. Does anybody remember how with the gameboy color you could change the palette by pressing directions at startup? Something like that with five good color schemes might be interesting.
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Quote DGH94 Replybullet Posted: 16 March 2010 at 2:22pm
Slightly off topic:
Have you guys thought of, instead of just having one background, having multiple, like the underground/water levels of Mario?

For the underground one, you could use the grass tiles - the grass (combination of both types of tiles), and all you would need would be spikes. :)

YES.

Dragon.
Emote. ;)
Wilbot's evil twin brother. xD
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Quote Robinhood Replybullet Posted: 16 March 2010 at 3:39pm
JLHHJLBVHJKVJ I accidentally hit a bookmark at the top when scrolling up and the back button was greyed out...... X_X  So retyping.

@ Ruban - Maybe.  It depends on whether or not GM can do it.

@ DGH94 - We're not going to just have one background.
Evil twin is a bit cliche.

28.1 and 2 -   Yes a antagonist!  The colors might be tweaked a bit later, right now he looks to... bad guy stereotypical for this game.

1.2 - Okay.  I will post the animation ASAP.

30.1 - Nope.  I don't think so.  How about you?

26.9 - Covers all screens and gameplay.

6.1 - I was thinking the same thing.  Maybe his head and antenna could spin around.

6.2 - Ahhhh more animations :D  This will be fun.  I haven't thought of anything yet.

And one more thing, we're going to need something to finish at.
Like in mario the castle, in Yoshi the ring, or in Sonic the thingy....  don't know what it is.

Gonna tackle that water animation.
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Quote kenpokis Replybullet Posted: 16 March 2010 at 4:25pm
I hope if we do go with my industrialization plot. That the end program could be a industrial slum. That way we can make the antagonist darker with more of a rust feel, something like that. The colors are great, but I would really like to see some different colors.
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Quote DGH94 Replybullet Posted: 16 March 2010 at 4:32pm
I think we need drop offs. Like in Mario. But at the bottom have spikes. :D and you'd need to take a running start or so.
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Quote Robinhood Replybullet Posted: 16 March 2010 at 4:47pm
Wilbot doesn't run :<


Crap water animation.  I'll fix the loop later along with frame rate.

EDIT:
realized what the problem was.
Pretty easy to fix :


Edited by TheRobinHood - 16 March 2010 at 4:51pm
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Quote kenpokis Replybullet Posted: 16 March 2010 at 5:34pm
Looks cool. Maybe at drop-offs have water, and if you fall in it shocks you to death. Which would match up with the wilbot death animation. XD
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Quote Robinhood Replybullet Posted: 17 March 2010 at 7:54am
Good idea ;)  Some levels will have water drop offs, some levels will not have any water at all, but open space.

#31 - Just a random idea, we should make levels where the level is set to go vertically with platforms leading upwards.

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Quote Ninja Crow Replybullet Posted: 17 March 2010 at 1:11pm
Okay guys, that's some great input, thanks!

28.1+2: That's a great design, which I really like the ideas behind. I can put him as a boss, as #21.C. A question, then:
21.C.1: I think he should be bigger than Wilbot, and a bit more humorously menacing, like with an underbite jaw (with one snaggletooth?) and maybe a single crossed-out eye or eyepatch. What do you think?
28.1+2: As promised, I'll throw out what I think about an antagonist: Yes, I think it can fit with the game, as I picture it so far from all the graphics to-date, etc. I would have suggested a lava dragon that lives in the heart of a volcano (especially since a fire/lava level would easily be challenging enough to deserve to be a final System) was my favourite idea so far, but I like Robin's bad guy, too. He can be the 'big boss' of the game, and have captured the lava dragon to do his bidding (because the dragon is cool, and I'm sentimental enough to not want it to be too evil, so if you are 'freeing' it from the bad guy by beating it in a battle, that feels a lot more happy and positive) and only after you defeat the dragon is the big boss forced to face you himself in the final, bonus System, using all his wily tricks against you. This type of big boss would be a colourful character in most things, so maybe he could be a bit of a pirate, with an eyepatch and a sword.
28.3: What do you think?
28.4: Okay, time for the next story-building question: "Where does the game take place?"
The funny thing is that after I asked the first question before, not really sure what the story should be, and wanting to go with what Robin would think up, all the things that have been said and shown about the game so far clicked and lined up for me, and suggested a story that I feel fits well with the material to date. It has a mix of fun and drama, and there's even some emotion sprinkled in. But, of course, we really need to hear everybody's ideas before deciding on anything, so I'll just throw out my own answer to this one question for now, to see what everybody thinks:
28.4: The title says it all, right? It's a strange atoll, and to be strange, it has to be someplace where the hero goes that's different from where he's from. I suggest that it can move across the ocean, and so one day Wilbot spots it from the shores of his own land, and decides to go investigate. Here's where we get the mystery and the exploration, and with lots of opportunity to 'find the fun', which is Shigeru Miyamoto's famous and fitting quote. I've loved this game from Robin's first mockup, and this setting gets all the happiness from that great expression Wilbot has, as well as leaving room for a bit of menace, too. (for example, Wilbot wouldn't yet know that the big boss is on the atoll, using the powers of the lava dragon - who lives in the island's volcano heart - to push the atoll through the ocean from one land of conquest to another.) This is what I like about coming up with stories: the answers to one question lead to answers for other questions that can then lead to even better ideas for early questions and so on and so on until something truly special emerges.
1.2: Cool animation, thanks, I'll add it to the Main DD.
30.1: I wanted to know, because for the game engine, he'll either float or swim or die when he hits the pools of water, and I needed to know which. (I do think that kenpokis's idea of the water shocking you does match a roboty theme.)
30.1: So what do you still think about whether he can swim? However:
30.2: Would you like a scuba powerup that lets him swim through certain underwater areas?
26.9: Okay.
6.1: As long as he looks playful and not like he's been hit, or having a short circuit, then I look forward to the animation. And:
6.3: Some more suggestions might be him lifting off his head and shaking out some sand, or kneeling down and digging in the ground with a little shovel (makes a little sand castle, or maybe just a little crab pops out - surprising Wilbot - and skitters away off the screen). You know, stuff like that. What do you think?
6.2: Okay. And:
6.4: It can be as simple as him jumping up and down, or something more complicated, like him blowing on his thumb to make his antennae swell into trumpet shapes that toot-de-toot in time to a victory sound effect. You know, stuff. What do you think?
32: Okay, I'll add a 'goal post' entry to the Main DD, but of course, that's just a technical term, it can be anything. So we'll ask everybody:
32.1: What do you think the 'goal post' should be? (I have a dim idea in mind, but will post it after everybody else's if it doesn't seem silly in comparison.)
6.5: "Wilbot doesn't run :<". Did you say this because you do or do not want Wilbot to run?
31: Sounds good to me. I'll put it under #24, for level design, in the Main DD.
26.8: You now have two 'water animation' entries in your To Do List - I think one should be changed to 'splash animation' and you might even be able to cross the other right off!

Okay, that's 10 pending questions. You don't have to get to everything today - I'll just repost any pending questions. Thanks!

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Quote Robinhood Replybullet Posted: 17 March 2010 at 3:48pm
2.1 -   I fixed the colors, but I tried to get it to tile with a higher level (higher raised platform) and I failed.  Pleeeaaase, can you make the higher platform tile stuff.  I can't do it for my life :c

21.C.1 - Okay!  For convenience, can you highlight all items to go onto the 'To Do List' in brown?

21.C.1 - All right!  Good idea.  I was thinking for the System 3, the first two levels could be on beach scenes, and Program 3 could be entering the volcano, where after completing the level, you would fight the dragon.  After knocking out the dragon, you would maybe fight the hunchback guy's minions, and then himself.

28.3 -  I think I got that covered above :)

28.4 - I dunno.  I like the 'spotting the atoll from his homeland and goes to investigate' part though.  Let's see what other people have to say :D

30.1  HE DIES.
Yes, he should be shocked and blown up when he touches water ;)
30.1 + 2 - A power up that let's him swim?  Interesting.  Maybe we could have like a Mario underwater level... More enemies :D

6.1 - Nope!  He won't ;)

6.3 - Maybe his head could pop off and spin :D


6.4 - Maybe...  I think spinning head might work. You?

32.1 - I'm dry of ideas.  I'd be willing to hear yours :)

6.5 - Unless you want him to.  I was thinking that it'd just complicate the game a whole lot more.  With the power ups and all.

26.8 - Fixed :D

I think that's all!


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Quote StraightBit Replybullet Posted: 17 March 2010 at 4:18pm
6.5
I think the main reason to let him run is to allow the player to play the game at a somewhat faster rate. Then again, there are other ways to speed up movement in the game - by introducing conveyor belts and teleports, for example.

As for a storyline, visually I thought this game was going into a Wall-E kind of direction. Here's one suggestion:

The planet is scattered with surviving robots and metalworks left there from generations long gone. The mechanic denizens have only one goal - survival. They zap (sap) energy from other robots (Wilbot) passing by. Scatter some batteries around the levels to make him restore energy. The goal for each (set of?) level(s) is to retrieve an object that will help him repair the fabled CPR (Central Power Regeneration) facilities, which are required to give the planet an unlimited supply of electricity and thereby save the world (and win the game, obviously).

Edited by StraightBit - 17 March 2010 at 4:20pm
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Quote kenpokis Replybullet Posted: 17 March 2010 at 4:21pm
Meh I think a volcano is too much like mario. I mean it's fine, but what about something more original like a industrial factory full of molten metal, and a robotic dragon/beast? I don't know I think since it is robotic that it would be cool. Just a thought.

EDIT: I like straightbit's idea too.


Edited by kenpokis - 17 March 2010 at 4:26pm
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Quote Robinhood Replybullet Posted: 17 March 2010 at 5:32pm
Great ideas guys!

6.5 - I like the idea, but err, I've never seen Wall-E...
ANYWAYS, the idea is nice, and I think the batteries can serve as 'energy' so you will be 'timed' throughout levels. Like thermal energy in Lost Planet.

@ kenpokis - Volcano is like Mario? Hehe, I like that industrial factory idea :)
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Quote kenpokis Replybullet Posted: 17 March 2010 at 5:47pm
Yea ya know like the bowser lava levels. Close enough lol.
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Quote StraightBit Replybullet Posted: 18 March 2010 at 5:31am
Originally posted by TheRobinHood

Great ideas guys!

6.5 - I like the idea, but err, I've never seen Wall-E...

That's not really important, just my observation. Wall-E starts with a left-behind robot on a desolate earth who occupies himself with collecting scrap metal and building things from them. The storyline is alltogether different though, and has more of an ecological message. Another inspiration might be Nitrome's Rustyard (which I think has beautiful pixel art, by the way).

ANYWAYS, the idea is nice, and I think the batteries can serve as 'energy' so you will be 'timed' throughout levels. Like thermal energy in Lost Planet.

I'm not familiar with Lost Planet, but if it means you need to reach the batteries before energy runs out then the game will certainly get a strategic / puzzle element to add to its platform origins. On the plus it adds a level of sophistication; on the minus, it gives the player less freedom of movement (the player has to choose or figure out the correct route). Question is whether or not you want that.
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Quote Ninja Crow Replybullet Posted: 18 March 2010 at 2:12pm
Hi guys! Wow, there's a lot of great comments, and I hope I don't miss anybody!

@ Ruban: Keeping the story simple is a good idea - we can always complicate it if needed after we're sure it's otherwise mostly complete! That's one reason why virtual reality is probably not an idea that may fit here, because most game players are used to stylised worlds, and automatically suspend their "that doesn't look real" reaction to enjoy the fantasy - which is what we want. If they had to wonder what was 'outside' the game, not only would this add a layer of complication, it would also prevent the player from being able to fully immerse themselves into the game fantasy world. If you don't think this is a very good reason, though, let me know! 17.4: I don't, personally, but I never had a GBC...anybody else?

@ StraightBit: I haven't seen Wall-E, either, but even though there is nothing wrong with your idea at all: when it comes to me, personally, I try to shy away from themes that involve the entire world and saving everything - to keep the setting and characters at a more 'human' level (easier to relate to; more intimate feel to things; more immediate threats; etc.). This doesn't actually make things 'less important' as might be assumed at first, but can actually make them more compelling. We have a strange reaction to terrible events, as a species, and to illustrate what I mean, I would submit that it was far more of an impact to viewers, in 'Star Wars: A New Hope', when Obi Wan died than when Alderan (a planet of billions, presumably) was blown up. So if we can make things work for just the environment of this mysterious atoll (threatening to collide with Wilbot's home, perhaps, and bring the big boss's conquest to their shores) then they would probably be more fitting things for the story (for example, activating batteries that do something for the level you are in, or give the atoll the power to return to its correct course and not collide with Wilbot's home). If you don't think this is good reasoning, though, let me know.
Another thing entirely personal to me, and probably not worried about by most others, is that I dislike time limits! I'd rather the challenge come from tricky jumps and clever puzzles than being forced to play quickly with some kind of 'cattle prod' technique - but then, I'm a bit lazy and like to be comfortable when I play, so I don't know about everybody else!

@ kenpokis: An industrial volcano is a pretty good idea, and I was wondering if there might be a System with a techno feel (and I guess a dragon in this game would have to be a robot anyway, right?) so if Robin likes the idea and wants to make some tilesheets that reflect a Volcano Factory, then that's fine with me.

2.1: I'd be happy to help make any of your tilesheets be able to repeat correctly, but:
2.9: I'm a little unclear as to what a 'higher raised platform' is for some reason - is there a picture of one which I can work with?
21.C.2: Sorry, I got a little confused and need this clarified: When you said "21.C.1 - Okay!", were you answering this question: "21.C.1: I think he should be bigger than Wilbot, and a bit more humorously menacing, like with an underbite jaw (with one snaggletooth?) and maybe a single crossed-out eye or eyepatch. What do you think?"?
21.C.3: Also, when you said "All right! Good idea. I was thinking for the System 3, the first two levels could be on beach scenes, and Program 3 could be entering the volcano, where after completing the level, you would fight the dragon. After knocking out the dragon, you would maybe fight the hunchback guy's minions, and then himself." were you answering this: "as I picture it so far from all the graphics to-date, etc. I would have suggested a lava dragon that lives in the heart of a volcano (especially since a fire/lava level would easily be challenging enough to deserve to be a final System) was my favourite idea so far, but I like Robin's bad guy, too. He can be the 'big boss' of the game, and have captured the lava dragon to do his bidding (because the dragon is cool, and I'm sentimental enough to not want it to be too evil, so if you are 'freeing' it from the bad guy by beating it in a battle, that feels a lot more happy and positive) and only after you defeat the dragon is the big boss forced to face you himself in the final, bonus System, using all his wily tricks against you. This type of big boss would be a colourful character in most things, so maybe he could be a bit of a pirate, with an eyepatch and a sword."?
28.4: You said: "Let's see what other people have to say :D", which is a good idea. I'd like to add to the "spotting the atoll from his homeland and goes to investigate" idea though, that I think it would be cool if he had a little boat or raft that he'd be in when the game starts, which would sail onto the game screen from the left, and go right up to the first beach of the atoll, and as soon as the boat touches the atoll, the player is given control, to hop out and go explore. For me, there is no better way to say 'you are at the beginning of a cool new world to explore' than to literally have everything yet to do be infront of you to the right, and you've just entered the very beginning of it, and no one has to be distracted by wondering what's behind you (because 'nothing but water' is the obvious answer, and this is the beginning of the Strange Atoll, and it's exciting to wonder what you will find there!) Plus, a little boat or raft would be adorable :3
28.5: So now that you've heard some ideas for a possible game setting, what do you like the most?
28.6: And now for today's story question: "what does the hero stand to gain or lose by his adventure?"
   This is just another way of saying 'what's his motivation?' Traditionally, heroes would go on adventures to gain glory or to save something or to prove they were grown up, etc. I think today's tastes prefer that the hero be saving something.
   For me, personally, I like to have a good time playing a game, and feel comfortable messing around, and trying different things in a level and obsessively collecting everything (do you pick up rupees even when your wallet is full? I sure do!). Having to worry that something or someone is about to come to harm is kind of a downer, for me - though plenty of good games do use this as a way to create urgency (but it's tricky to do well).
   So I advocate a build up of the drama, to always be giving the player more reasons to play than they even started out with. For example, if Wilbot sees the Atoll on the horizon, he wants to go there because he's curious and adventurous, and once there we're having a good time playing the level and seeing all this new stuff.
   This creates that first 30 minutes of joy that Miyamoto recommends. But then he learns that the Atoll isn't just floating by, it's on a collision course and only he can stop it. See how the drama builds up a notch, but we're comfortable in the story now, and the danger is more meaningful to us now? (you never want to put something in danger that you don't yet care about! But now we like Wilbot, and by extension his home and friends, and now we care!)
   We can even step up the drama one more time by having the bad guy get frustrated that he can't stop Wilbot's progress through the Atoll, and so tries kidnapping one of Wilbot's friends to force our hero to back off. But Wilbot will save his friend and defeat the bad guy, giving us a great climax with a lot of emotional connection for us as players because it was built up slowly and unfolded like a story.
   And the reason for only having a single friend to worry about saving is to keep things simple - plus you only ever have to show one other type of Wilbot character. My suggestion is a female type of Wilbot - and whether it was a wife or girlfriend doesn't have to be specified if you don't want to decide whether Wilbot is old enough to be married or whatever.
   Of all the types of people that Wilbot would care about, I picked this one for the following reasons: a parent would beg the question, where's the other, and we don't want to have to deal with two or ask how they react to the kidnapping of their spouse - we only want to deal with Wilbot. A child would just be much more terrible to put in danger than a more grown up character. A random friend or person from Wilbot's world would just not be close enough to Wilbot - whether he liked them or not - for our purposes.
   We could be introduced to this female character at the very beginning of the game - she'd be there when Wilbot hops into his boat/raft to go off to the Atoll, wishing him luck with a wave. So she as a character would also perform the symbolic job of showing us what important things Wilbot left in order to investigate the Atoll. You wouldn't need a village with lots of people, just a single other bot who obviously cares for Wilby. Thus, it is set up for us to feel all the more incensed when the bad guy has the gall to kidnap this nice person whom Wilbot cares for!
So that's my own answer to today's story question, and my reasoning behind it: I think the drama should build in steps (so that it stays fun and helps keep the game from becoming flat in later stages) until we see that Wilbot's motivation is to save his home and then someone he loves (but only one, whom the bad guy kidnaps to try to stop Wilbot from doing that saving stuff). But what do you guys think?
30.1: "HE DIES". Works for me. "Maybe we could have like a Mario underwater level... More enemies :D". If you want one, with a scuba powerup too, that's cool, and if you want to make some swimming enemies, that's cool too. So:
24.1: What do you think?
6.1: "Nope! He won't ;)". Okay, I look forward to seeing it.
6.3: That's fine, whatever you think will be fun to make!
6.4: I think maybe his head can spin, lifting him off the ground a bit, then he drops back down and strikes a pose with a big big smile. The pose can be like this dude, but with the elbows bent more (and his fists need to go up and then down in emphasis).
32.1: Hmm, some good ideas have been put around, so I'll list some possibilities: a cute mailbox to send home all the collectibles you've gotten so far to his people/family/friends who wonder about his progress; a vending machine that can give you the option to then purchase items if you have enough points, and also seems a good point to record your progress; and finally, a battery/machine of some sort (as suggested by StraightBit) - though I have no idea what turning it on may do, though turning it off may be a way of foiling the bad guy (for example slowing the atoll's advance toward your home). This last one would help also if you wanted vending machines inside of levels and not at just the ends of them, and I think I'm starting to like it. So:
32.2: What do you think now?
6.5: "I was thinking that it'd just complicate the game a whole lot more". I agree, and I certainly don't want to have to hold down a 'run' button the whole time - I ought to be able to tweak the walking in the GM engine well enough so that he has just the right kind of motion for action as well as precision.

26.10: If you like the water/wave animation, you can give that entry a strike-through.
26.11: I don't see a splash animation entry yet... :)
26.12: I only see one strike-through - what is the second finished item?

Okay, that's 7 pending questions, and 3 To Do List items. You don't have to get to everything today - I'll just repost any pending questions. Thanks!

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Quote kenpokis Replybullet Posted: 18 March 2010 at 2:24pm
2.9: I believe he is talking about it tiling upwards. For higher raised ground levels.  
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Quote Robinhood Replybullet Posted: 18 March 2010 at 5:41pm
2.9 -Correct!

@Ninja Crow - I read your post, but I will get to it tomorrow, sorry! D:

24.3 - I was just playing Sonic for Ideas, and I noticed that the background did not move or change whatsoever as you progressed the level.  I think that's a good idea :)
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Quote Ruban Replybullet Posted: 19 March 2010 at 7:24am
What about level design?

Would it be centered more around platforming or more around combat?

If platforming, new platforms would have to be made. Moving ones need to be made no matter what/

If combat, more, and more difficult enemies.
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Quote Robinhood Replybullet Posted: 20 March 2010 at 4:15pm
33 - This game is going to be freeware right?  Non-profit.
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Quote DGH94 Replybullet Posted: 21 March 2010 at 4:24pm
Any new sprites?
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Quote Robinhood Replybullet Posted: 21 March 2010 at 6:00pm
No, been busy ;__;
sorry guys
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Quote Robinhood Replybullet Posted: 22 March 2010 at 8:24am
Started on the front page ish thing.  Just got the AA in.

I promise I'll get yto your last post when I get home ;_;  Sorry, but I had a lot of homework, and when I finished, I spent my time outside, the weather was so nice -o-;;
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Quote Ninja Crow Replybullet Posted: 22 March 2010 at 10:51am
Don't worry about it - take the time you need for awesome!

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Quote Robinhood Replybullet Posted: 22 March 2010 at 3:22pm
I need an answer to #33 - Post 20 March 2010 at 7:15pm.

17.4
- I don't care how realistic it is.  Yeah I have one :)

2.9 - answered above ;)

21c.2 - Yes I agree with that idea. :D

21c.3 - Yes I was answering that

28.5 - I think the 'spotting the island' is the best, bu the story should be simple and straight to the point.  Like Mario.  Save Peach.  Kirby.  Get Cake.  Something like that :)

28.6 - Erm, I don't know.  :<

24.1 - SOrry, what's 24.1?

32.1 - Still dry of ideas.  Probably because I just ran about a billion miles at Track tryouts.  I have them for the next two days, and right after that, I have Band competitions, and then a few projects and essays for school.
Bleagh.


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Quote Ninja Crow Replybullet Posted: 23 March 2010 at 12:48pm
@ Ruban: definitely centered around platforming - if that's okay with Robin - and the enemies are just cute obstacles. That's the type of game I prefer, anyway.

by the way, the green number in the Main DD represents the one that you can use, not the last one used (so if it says 24.2, that's what you type, not 24.3) but if that's too confusing, just let me know!

24.3: That's fine with me, and makes backgrounds a lot easier, too.
33: I have no personal plan to make any kind of money at poor Wilbot's expense - I'm willing to go freeware and opensource all the way! Nothing should stop people, no matter who or where they are, from being able to experience the awesome that is Wilbot!
17.4: Cool.
10.2: What games do you have for your GBC?
2.9: Okay, then post or PM me any kind of picture or mockup of what kind of higher raised platform you want (I don't mind how quick or dirty it is) with the higher raised platform circled and I'll do my best to make it tile and repeat nicely.
21.C.2: Right ho, then I look forward to a smashing new picture of the chap.
21.C.3: Alright, then I'll add the pertinent details to the Main DD.
28.5: I agree completely with simple and direct (after all, the more complicated it becomes, the more work to do! ) so as far as I'm concerned, the stuff that has been said so far is all the game needs. I'll update the Main DD with the summary that I like the best, and if nobody objects to it, I'll consider it official!
28.6: That's okay, I'll be perfectly all right with assuming his motivation comes naturally from his situation (as summarised in the story update in the Main DD) which I feel is simple, clear, and direct.
24.1: It's three things, realy: (24.4) do you for sure want underwater Programs (or areas in the Programs), and (24.5) do you want a scuba powerup as the only way to get into those underwater areas, and (24.6) do you want some underwater enemies (e.g. fish, octopi, etc.).
32.2: (you typed '32.1' but I'm assuming it's for the same question) Track and band and essays sounds like a very full schedule! I'm okay with going with some kind of battery device at the end of each level that you blow up like a prison egg in Sonic the Hedgehog. These would power a Motivator (a device attached to marine propellers under the island, and would be how the Strange Atoll moves through the ocean) that would be at the end of the third Program of each System, but before you can blow up the Motivator, you have to defeat a boss....
32.3: What do you think?

there's also these three things that you might want to do for your To Do List:
26.10: If you like the water/wave animation, you can give that entry a strike-through.
26.11: I don't see a splash animation entry yet... :)
26.12: I only see one strike-through - what is the second finished item?

Okay, that's 6 pending questions, and 3 pending To Do items. You don't have to get to everything today - I'll just repost anything left over. Thanks!

Latest unused category number: 34

Link to Main Design Document
Link to To Do List

Edited by Ninja Crow - 23 March 2010 at 12:49pm

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Quote Robinhood Replybullet Posted: 24 March 2010 at 5:14pm

Update :P
Which color scheme do you like best?

Anyways, I just ran about 40 100 m and 200m dashes plus a few 400 m's and more.
It hurts to walk X_x
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Quote Ruban Replybullet Posted: 24 March 2010 at 5:51pm
Call me a little late, but I don't really like the title. Its not bad art, but it just doesn't fit the style of the game. Its too, rounded. I'd go for a view of the island, (In same, ingame perspective) With some nice simple letters, 
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Quote Robinhood Replybullet Posted: 24 March 2010 at 6:10pm
Hmm, I guess you're right.  Maybe something like in the banner with the island like in Yoshi's story?



Maybe the base of the island could look something like this
Its very rough ATM.


Edited by TheRobinHood - 24 March 2010 at 6:19pm
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Quote Ninja Crow Replybullet Posted: 25 March 2010 at 10:40am
I'd suggest the 'light green' colour for the background to look like a happy sky, and also so that parts of Wilbot's head don't look transparent.

Having a shot of the Atoll is a good idea too (I'd like to see a picture of it during the title sequence, for example). If you need any inspiration, I found some cool pics of atolls.
This one I found striking because it has a square shape, and so you don't have to feel bad if you want a geometrical shape for your island cluster.
This one is also very cool, and you can more easily see that there is a string of islands poking up, surrounded by shallow, tropical waters and coral reefs. It doesn't seem like too much of a stretch to imagine Wilbot going from island to island in the atoll, in a linear path, with each one having its own theme (such as "beach", "lagoon", "mountain", "volcano", etc.).

23.4: What do you think of kenpokis's industrial volcano idea? I imagine a factory city powered by lava, with flying spark effects (courtesy of GM) and hanging chains with hooks that you can ride (or which can also carry buckets, etc.) with the volcano in the background and a cool cloudy sky, like Hot Crater in Sonic Advance 2 (as seen here, and it gets redder closer to the ground, as seen here). note: I'll update the Main DD to show this number has been used on my next full-sized post.

Thanks!

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Quote kenpokis Replybullet Posted: 25 March 2010 at 1:07pm
Yea i'm picturing a star wars 3 where obi wan and anakin duke it out.
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Quote DGH94 Replybullet Posted: 27 March 2010 at 2:57pm

I made a scorpion. I was bored, and tried your style TRH. Very fun to play with. That's supposed to be a poison dart or so comin out of it, not the tip. xD


I also made an un-finished turtle.

Feel free to use either/change em, whatever.
EDIT:



I've also tried my luck at the rhino, but have failed horribly. And I'm really looking forward to whoever can make it!   

Edited by DGH94 - 27 March 2010 at 6:17pm
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Quote Robinhood Replybullet Posted: 29 March 2010 at 6:27am


Made the tileset edits, in two colors.  Like i said before, I can't get them to tile correctly on the upwards and higher platforms :c  Also made the walthrough-able and non walkthrough-able tiles.  Made the upwards tilt on the the platforms less pronounced so Wilbot wouldn't look so weird walking on them.

EDIT:    Working on wormbot and added sopts to giraffe


Edited by TheRobinHood - 29 March 2010 at 6:40am
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Quote wenruto Replybullet Posted: 29 March 2010 at 12:22pm
From What I've seen  TThat game's gonna be awesome  I Love it already Good Luck Man =)
Earn free stuff by searching like Google
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Quote Robinhood Replybullet Posted: 29 March 2010 at 3:38pm
thanks wenruto!


Animated the wurmbot (or is it wormbot?  I like wurmbot better)

Anyways, it looks a bit plain, I was thinking that he should bounce up a bit (the bottom segment) when he rises.  What about you guys?
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Quote Ninja Crow Replybullet Posted: 29 March 2010 at 4:02pm
@ DGH94: thanks, man, those are pretty cool (though I think the claws on the scorpobot look a little too much like horns).

@ wenruto: thanks for your support!

@ TRH: I totally agree about the bottom bouncing up on the wormy bot, which would give him a cute hopping animation for a walk - and 'wurmbot' is a fine name for it, too.

Heh, I spent a bit on the tileset, and here's an edit, which shows how I always thought it would work (the GIF shows, in each frame, all the identical squares - there's a clean frame at the beginning, for use in the game, if you like it so far). I also found a few mistakes I had made and fixed those, so if you want to do any more edits, please use this one (the first frame is the clean one).

I wasn't sure whether you wanted the brown version for a different Program, or for a 'walk in front' layer (please let me know), but if you like what I've done with today's edit, I'll fix the brown one too.

If you like it, all you have to remember is always put tiles from "B" columns next to tiles from "A" columns (never put As next to As or Bs next to Bs).

For your convenience, here are the two links to the two previous posts of mine with the pending questions:
(1) and (2).

Thanks guys!

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Quote Robinhood Replybullet Posted: 29 March 2010 at 4:13pm

Penguin guy :D  Head is weird, but I looks weirder to me if I move it once every two frames...

For the tileset:  Hehe, I get how it works now :)  Just one thing.  While at school playing a game on a computer  While playing a game, I realized how weird Wilbot would look standing or walking on slanted slopes, so.... Solution for that.  :/
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Quote Robinhood Replybullet Posted: 29 March 2010 at 5:47pm
MONSTER DESIGN DOCUMENT


#1 - Bunnybot - Equivalent to the Goomba from Super Mario Bros, but will not dumbly walk off edges.  Very easy to kill, just a simple stomp to the head will do.  Does minimum damage.
Found in all Systems.

#2 - Whalebot (TBA) - Lives only in water.  Will jump out of water at intervals.  A stomp to the head will kill it.  Does minimum damage, but chances are, if you run into this guy, you'll fall into the water and blow up.
Found in all
Found in all Systems, but only in Programs with water. (duh)

#3 - Crocbot (To be animated) - A flying crocidile that flys around and annoyingly poops bombs that fall slowly on you head.  Poor Wilbot.  Running/jumping into it will result in minimum damage, but being hit by the eplosion or the bomb will reult in mid high damage.
Found in all Systems, starting with the 2nd or 3rd Program.

#4 - Spikebot  - A bot that annoyingly runs around and hurts you.  Jumping on it will result in mid damage, and running into it will result in mid low damage.
Found in all Systems, but only in Programs with the hammer power up.

#5 - Bouncebot - A bot that bounces, moving or stationary.  You can either walk under it and not kill the unfortunate thing, or you can choose to cruelly stomp it to death.  Does mid low damage.
Found in all Systems.

#6 - Pandabot (Mistakes to be fixed) - Stomp it, it'll split into two smaller ones.  Stomp thoose too and go along your merry way.  Large one does mid low damage, and the small one does minimum damage.
Can be found in all Systems except Ice/Snow System.

#7 - Neckbot (To be animated) - To kill this bot, jump on its hind section (which should be extended in the future) and then when it drops to the ground, stomp its head.  If you are lucky enough to be able to directly jump on its head, then it will die immediatly.  Does mid low damage.
Can be found starting on the second System.

#8 - Pengibot - Same as Bunnybot, except it walks faster.
Found only in the Ice/Snow System.

#9 - Caterbot (mistakes to be fixed) - A bot that bounces and you must stomp it repeatedly until all the segments fly out.  Then stomp it's head to finish it off (Or a single stomp will do, depending on what we decide) Does mid damage.
Found in all Systems except the Ice/Snow System.

Possible enemies

  • Molebot
  • Scorpbot
  • Turtlebot
Bosses
  • Dragbot
  • Rhinebot
  • Hunchbot (something to do with "Igor" would be funny :D)
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Quote DGH94 Replybullet Posted: 29 March 2010 at 6:49pm
Maybe it's just me, but I really want the penguin to have an 'ability.' Maybe sliding on his tummy? Like faster than his working speed?  Plase?
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Quote Robinhood Replybullet Posted: 30 March 2010 at 8:11am
Couple o quick updates:
  added some stuff to feet


Added bounce
Changed giraffe thing



Edited by TheRobinHood - 30 March 2010 at 8:35am
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Quote DGH94 Replybullet Posted: 30 March 2010 at 1:10pm
Have you guys seen Jalonso's version of WilBUG? We (well you) need to use it!!!
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Quote kenpokis Replybullet Posted: 30 March 2010 at 1:52pm
I like the updates! Only thing I would say is to give the penguin more of a waddle. The sliding belly is a cool idea too.
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Quote jalonso Replybullet Posted: 03 April 2010 at 8:08am
Here's a bug. Use/edit/whatever :)

*originally for the challenge but now removed.
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Quote Alcala Replybullet Posted: 04 April 2010 at 12:47pm
I really like the style and I tried it myself with some of my style, and its a weird to say it but, this is a really interesting thing to do, I can try to help with some things, althought RobinHood already seen what I have done b trying to copy his style, and I dunno if its ok at all, but if there is anything I could do no need to bother.
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Quote Ninja Crow Replybullet Posted: 05 April 2010 at 2:17pm
@ jalonso: Thanks for posting your Wilbug images - they're terrific!

@ Alcala: Thank you for your interest, it's nice to have people enjoying the project!

@ TRH: Your Monster Design Document is awesome, and very well written - colour me impressed!

I have taken the liberty of creating a range of animations for the penguin (callin' it "Pengubot" for now, since it's easy to say), based on what you've shown so far:

I changed the head a bit (since you mentioned it was 'weird') to help give the walk a cute, penguinish 'waddle'. It has a wing flap animation (twice) and a walk animation (two cycles) and a run animation (two cycles) and finally a jump and slide animation.

The idea is that if you don't bounce on it before it slides at you, it will be moving a lot faster, and will be harder to hit, plus it will knock right into you if you don't jump over it.

I'll consider it finished if you have no objections.

Also, here's a link to the updated, edited tileset with the latest fixes to make it tile properly, incase you didn't get a copy yet. I'll consider it finished, too, if you have no objections.

For convenience, here are the two links to the last two posts I made which still have pending questions:
(1) & (2).

Again, lovin' that Monster Doc.

Th-that's all for now.

Link to Main Design Document
Link to To Do List
Link to Monster Design Document

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Quote Cubeshaped Replybullet Posted: 05 April 2010 at 11:27pm
Hello, I have a few question about this project.

236.1 What screen resolution are you planning to use for your project?

236.2 The maximum color on screen going to be 6 correct?

236.3 Should this game have an overworld map? I might come up with a mock-up

237.1 This question isn't available at this moment.  Please leave an answer after the beep.

237.2 My brain is being eaten by zombies, can you help me? 

238.1 Story, I will try to conjour up something. 

238.2 What tile size should we use?

That's all the question I have atm...

Possible answer

236.2 6 colors!!!

237.2 Nevermind, it was a vampire bat. 

238.2 Screen resolution 160x144 = 8x8 tiles, 256x224 16x16 tiles, 320x240 24x24 tiles.  As long we're not taking this game up to 1920x1080, which requires 128x128 tiles. 
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Quote Robinhood Replybullet Posted: 06 April 2010 at 10:47am
@ Ninja Crow - Thank you!

Love that new sprite, my only pointer is that the smoke might not be visible depending on the background.  It's so cute <3
I shall update the Monster DD.

#1 Pending questions
10.2 - Pokemon Blue and Yellow.  For GBoy color, I got Pokemon Gold and Super Mario Bros Deluxe or whatever it's called.  I can't seem to find Gold though.  You? :D
2.9 - Resolved
32.2 - I was thinking about the story line, and I think it should be simplified.  If you think about it, Mario's storyline is "Rescue Peach".  And Kirby's is "Get Cake".  Of course other game's like Bad Company or MW2 might have more complicated storylines, but I'm all for simple ones.  With the one we have now (Him seeing the island and going to go investigate), could be made a lot simpler.  What do you think?
Oh and destroying the Motivators at the end of a world sounds good to me.

I was thinking System 1 - 3 levels.  "Normal System"
The second Program could be an underwater System?
System 2 - Ice/Snow world
Second Program is ice, first and third are snow.
System 3 - Tropical
First Program is beach, second is underwater, and the third is inside the volcano
System 4 - Boss!
Inside volcano, final boss

Just an idea! :D

Pending Questions #2
Sounds good :)

@ Cubeshaped - Please use the actual numbers, and not 3 digits... It makes it all confusing :c

236.1 - I think 480 x 320
236.2 - If possible :)
236.3 - That will be made when the time comes :)
238.2 - 480 x 320 with 32x32 tiles.

Which reminds me
@ Ninja Crow and everyone else
SINCE THE SLOPES ARE AT SUCK A LARGE ANGLE, WILBOT MAY LOOK SLIGHTLY WEIRD IF HE STANDS OR WALKS ON THEM
Solutions?

Oh and I may make another mockup using your tilesets, that okay? :)

  Tilesets are used like this right?  Split into these sections :D




Edited by Robinhood - 06 April 2010 at 10:50am
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Quote Ninja Crow Replybullet Posted: 06 April 2010 at 4:49pm
Hello, Cubeshaped. Unless something comes up, the answers to your questions are:

236.1: Screen resolution matches the latest mockups, at 480 x 320.

236.2: The maximum number of colours for resources (sprites, tiles, etc.) on display at any one time will be held at a total of six if humanly possible. As for the colour count for any one freeze-frame of the game, well that will go a little higher because of smooth rotation effects, or whatever - but everything starts at a hand-pixelled six colours.

236.3: I'm hoping so. See this post and this post (looks like a map outline, eh?) for some possible ideas.

237.1: If you would like to reach technical support, please press <square root of -2345.653> now.

237.2: AAAH!!!

238.1: The working story is here at number 28 - please try not to suggest anything too ambitious!

238.2: I'd say 8 x 8 as the base (there are some grouped into 32 x 32 for convenience, and so on, but it should be divisible by 8).

236.2: Yup.

237.2: Phew!.

@ TRH:YW!

I'm glad you like the sprite! The smoke is there for a place-holder until I can test it against different backgrounds. And thanks to kenpokis for suggesting the waddle idea.

10.2: I rented Zelda:Oracle of Seasons from GameFly for my GameBoyPlayer, and back when I had an original GameBoy I had Tetris (like, duh, right?) Batman, Final Fantasy Adventure, and some kind of racing game with cars in a tube (maybe more - went through a lot of used packs).
2.9: Okay, but:
2.10: I really would like to know if the ground that you can walk in front of (and therefore jump up on to) is going to be colour-shifted from the normal colours. You can see what I mean by this on the tileset image I put below (in #2.11), where there is a bump-up on the ground (on the mockup section below the main tileset).
32.2: Yes, simplicity sounds excellent to me. As far as I know, the entire story so far can be summarised by saying 'stop the runaway island', which should be right in line with a Mario-level simplicity. There's a bad guy, of course, and he can kidnap your friend near the end to give a bit of drama to the last battle, but nothing more complicated than that, as far as I know. If you want to point out anything specific you'd like removed, that's fine - otherwise I'll go on the assumption it's simple enough as is.
26.13: Okay, then if Motivators it is, please put a 'Make battery & Motivator sprite' on your To Do List. The motivators are bigger than the batteries, and might look something like this or this or this or this.
23.5: I really like your ideas on the World structure. May I make some suggestions for further refinement? The first System can be called "Strange Grassland", then "Strange Snowfield", and finally, "Strange Beachhead (a great pun I hope, since it's a beach, and the enemy base is also in this System)". These don't have to show up on screen, but just be what we call them during development (unless you like them a lot ). I think there can be an underwater Program in each System (which would just mean replacing one of the two snow Programs with an icy underwater Program - swimming around under icebergs for example) and I think that each Program can have a themed power-up (jetpack in first grassland program, then scuba in second underwater program, etc.). If you like the ideas in this question (23.5) then I've got some more ideas for the rest of the programs and powerups....
26.14: So if there is an underwater Program in System One, should you put a 'Make up underwater enemies (like fish or octopi)' entry in your To Do List?
24.7: You said, "SINCE THE SLOPES ARE AT SUCK A LARGE ANGLE, WILBOT MAY LOOK SLIGHTLY WEIRD IF HE STANDS OR WALKS ON THEM", which I'm going to take as a Level Design question, and try to answer by saying that both Mario and Sonic have 45-degree slopes, and there are enough standard ways of dealing with those (such as having the 'solid' part of the character be narrower at the feet than the body - which is all done inside the GM code - and having the player slide down when on slopes so that they don't look funny just standing there) that I don't think there will be any problems. For speed of development, I'm working under the assumption that this problem doesn't really exist.
2.11: You said, "Tilesets are used like this right? Split into these sections :D", which I'm taking as a tileset question (#2.11) and will answer with this image. You cut them up at slightly incorrect positions, so I made this one with everything strictly divisible by 8 or 32. At the bottom of this image is a mockup showing the tileset in action, and at the top is the tileset itself, which consists of two upward slant columns, two normal columns, two edging columns, and two downward slant columns. (remember that they alternate as "A, B, A, B" and to never put a B column next to a B - or an A next to an A - and that Bs only stack on Bs and so on) Notice on the four slant columns that I didn't bother putting the very bottom section on, because it's just a copy from the matching normal column (B onto B, A onto A). I also didn't show the cap on the top of the second normal column, because it's the same as the cap of the first column. I also decided to make the section that is second from the top of the normal column be optional, because in one of your mockups or tilesets the 'walk in front' ground had less between the grass and the stone pattern than the normal ground it was next to, and I thought this contrast looked cool (you can still see this on this image on the brown bumpup on the mockup section).
13.5: You said, "Oh and I may make another mockup using your tilesets, that okay? :)", which I'm calling a mockup question, and my answer here is, if you mean an image to put in your PJ gallery, then not only would I be super excited to see a new image from you, I'd feel very privileged if you liked my edit enough to use (and after all, they're based on your patterns) and if you think enough of the edit makes them partly mine, just link me in your description, as per the new PJ collaboration rules. But in return, may I post the penguin as a collaboration to my own gallery?


there's also these three things that you might want to do for your To Do List:
26.10: If you like the water/wave animation, you can give that entry a strike-through (it's right below storyline).
26.11: I don't see a splash animation entry yet... :)
26.12: I only see two strike-throughs - what is the third finished item?
26.15: If you like the pengubot animation, you can strike out the 'Animate penguin with flapping wing/arm' entry!

Okay, that's 3 pending questions, and 6 To Do List questions. You don't have to get to everything today - I'll just repost any pending questions. Thanks!

Latest unused category number: 34

Link to Main Design Document
Link to To Do List
Link to Monster Design Document

!Strange Atoll - The Amazing Wilbot Game Project!
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