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ChrisButton
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Quote ChrisButton Replybullet Posted: 30 November 2010 at 11:09pm

The art and programming is coming along nicely, glad to see you've poured so much effort into it. I've been sick for a while, so I wasn't on the computer much so don't bother about swap depths, you were right anyways Jaume. I was going to suggest some musical imput in the game before you guys brought it up. But I was having trouble with converting midi files (because Flash cannot play midi files) and my internet was capped at the time.

If you need help on how to go about programming a sequence of notes feel free to ask.
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Quote ChrisButton Replybullet Posted: 30 November 2010 at 11:26pm
Oh yeah. I was thinking about the music thing again. The reason I had chosen midi files was because they sound like the retro sprite games or if you use 8 bit plugins or whatever. Because real music to sprite games is kinda weird imo! :D
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Quote JaumeAlcazo Replybullet Posted: 04 December 2010 at 12:14pm
UPDATE 7:

Exe format (for Windows):

http://rapidshare.com/files/434900459/Medici.exe
Mirror: http://www.megaupload.com/?d=DPJTHNQW

Swf format (for Mac, Linux, Windows, etc...)

http://rapidshare.com/files/434901186/Medici.swf
Mirror: http://www.megaupload.com/?d=XTCNAEKI

Things done

0 - I'm still leaving the collision detection visibles for now. For new readers, when I talk about floor1 I'm talking about the things that must be drawn above Leo, instead of below. I'm also leaving visibles the red squares that bring you in/out of the places. At the moment we're still in debug mode.
1 - Now you can enter and exit the Library. Library has collision detection+floor1. The basement of the library still doesn't work.





2 - You can enter/exit the new Cathedral, with collision detection+floor1+slowers in the stairs. The pushing blocks still doesn't work.







3 - You can enter/exit Shop 1 and Shop 2, with collision detection+floor1.





4 - You can enter/exit the house of Mona Lisa, with collision detection+floor1. I probably was drunk or something when programming this, and I did this as a Y-scroll of 2 screens height. I think it doesn't look right (it doesn't seem to me as if you're going to the floor above). Should I do this as 2 independent screens ?





5 - You can enter/exit the empy house, with collision detection+floor1. I put a post sign in the outside "Empty House", but will obviously not go in the final release. We are only debugging at the moment : )



6 - Corrected the bug that Stats pointed (now you can only talk to a npc if you are close to him/her), and the text the npc says too ("either") : )

Originally posted by Stats


When talking to the priest, and you say, I don't like you it should say Ha ha, I don't like you either!

Also, after wandering though walls in the catherdral I pressed 'A' randomly.

1. It brought up the dialog with the pope.
2. Tile background changed to the outside
3. The game locked up.




7 - Rewrited the scrolling system (as I explained more in a previous post), so the chunks are not longer attached and removed but *moved*. This is (cpu) faster, but I'm not seeing big difference of speed. Maybe later, with more npcs and things around Florence, this could be of help.

Docks

- I can see your points jal, maybe we can have the "busy" docks in another city, later in the game? : )

Performance thoughts

- As some of you maybe have guessed, I'm very worried about lagging. I think the credits at the beginning are lagging the game for me sometimes. I'm very worried about this. I tried to disable them and it didn't lag. Maybe we can exchange the current credits (white ttfs with black transparency filters around the text) with images, or completely get rid of them. What do you think about this ?

I'm having this problem only at "big" resolution, other resolutions work well.

Please, tell me how the game performs in your computer, at various resolutions, etc.. I think I'll go gpu hardware acceleration for the next update (with flash player 10, instead of flash player 8).

- I explored some actionscript performance improvers, but at the moment with no success: haXe, taas and apparat, etc...

May be I could compile against flash player 10 instead of flash player 8, and activate gpu hardware graphics acceleration. I hope can do this for the next update.

- Another idea is to drop the fps from 40 to 35 or 30? Do you know any way to see the FPS in flash player when playing the game?

Chris

- Thanks for your help : ) If actionscript can't play midis maybe one idea could be playing the midi in a external program, with the "retro" filter, and convert it to mp3, and then play the mp3 from the game.

Smallest resolution

- I tried to explain this in the past update, but I got no response, so I'll try to explain myself with images. We must (eventually) do a choice. What do you want to see in smallest resolution:

This?:



Or this? (I extend the map to fill the whole screen)



The second option is harder to do, and to write, but I vote for the second option, but I'm not sure. I need thoughts on this, please.

A big thanks

To all of you, for your time, for your constant support, and for your kind words : )

Edited by JaumeAlcazo - 04 December 2010 at 1:28pm
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Quote jalonso Replybullet Posted: 04 December 2010 at 2:07pm
That was fun to walk around :)
Some minor flaws here and there with the art being cut up, like the inside entrance of the cathedral.

I don't know about programming decisions and what players would like.
I have been pixelling and designing based on this being what the player sees at all times. I am using a lot of overhead shadows and atmosphere BGs based on this window/resolution size.

I never commented because I thought for resolution you meant 100%/200%/400% but the window remains the same scale/proportion as far as what the player sees...so I don't know what to say.

For now we can leave the start screen section as a placeholder and we can revisit this soon. I still think more dock is pointless :/

Sneak preview of what I'm working on. Gypsy camp and Leo's house/studio in the outskirts of town.

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Quote ChrisButton Replybullet Posted: 05 December 2010 at 4:48am
Someone help, I need jaw surgery! *Jaw drops off*
 
Jal, as per usual, your art is flawless, and I am eagerly awaiting the placement of your upcoming gypsy camp. The buildings bear a strong resemblance to that of the buildings in LoZ: The Minish Cap, and I love it. Initially I thought that about the whole town, but now without a doubt I'm sure you've incorporated atleast some of that game's element. Kudos for the great appropriations, and keep spriting!
 
Jaume, in reguards to your resolution worry - I believe you shouldn't do neither the first or second option, but maybe something inbetween! I know you will find the right balance, and when you find it, you will just know it's right! I like the idea of your collision detection and how you make the transparent coloured blocks the things being detected, and then when it comes game time, will you set the alpha of those blocks to 0%? It was a smart idea to make the stairs slow down Leo too!

I like what I see, and this game is starting to remind me of one of Newground's quickly made, quickly famous games: The Room Tribute http://www.newgrounds.com/portal/view/547307 
Beware however, as this game contains nudity!


Edited by ChrisButton - 05 December 2010 at 5:20am
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Quote JaumeAlcazo Replybullet Posted: 06 December 2010 at 9:05am
Now I post some ideas for the White Tower/Dungeons, that we talked with jal some days ago. Some of them are high fantasy/magical, so may not fit a more "historical" Leonardo game. Not necessary to put this in Florence, maybe on another city, or some things maybe in another game xD

As always, you can take what you wish : )

The Whiter Tower/Dungeons/Enchanted tower/Evil tower, ideas, inspiration, puzzle layouts:

- I used some pictures from Forgotten Realms: Unlimited Adventures, for reference and inspiration : )
- The tower is made of marble, is white and very shiny.
- There are torches in the walls.
- The tower is split in many levels:

The underground level:

- This level/cave/dungeons is full of creepy worms that attack you/block you to reach certain places. To get rid of the worms you have to throw a burning torch through a hole/dwell in the ground. In this way you burn the central hatchery/main nest of the worms, and the worms don't appear anymore. A deep pit is also found in this level. You can't go across the pit, but a switch can be seen at the other side of the pit. Using some invention or talking/convincing some npc, you can make him/her push the switch and a bridge appears, that lets you go to the other side.



- There are chained skeletons in some jails in this level.
- A secret cave/easter egg holds the skeleton of a dragon, with skeletons of all his victims.

Level 0:

- A sad chained prisoner is found in one jail. If you release him, he will help you.

Level 1:

- An iron golem/statue blocks your pass somewhere. You must find the right switch to make the golem/statue move his body/sword/etc to let you pass.

Level 2:

- A quiet character is lying in his room. He/she smokes and helps you giving you something, or some clue, or doing something for you.



Level 3:

- A ghost of a soldier, that resembles genghis khan, blocks your way in a long corridor. There is also smoke, as if this is a vision or something. Imagine you feel the smell of burnt incense. You must bring him some relic from his live (which is in the deepest undergrounds) to let him rest in peace. Maybe a helmet, or a sword, or a loved possession from his live.





Level 4:

- Here is a room with some jars/vases. One jar contains an evil spirit.



- Here is also a young beautiful lady, that after talking with her or doing something, somehow her is transformed in a ugly,creepy, old witch.

Level 5:

- You can't see anything. All is very dark. You must find a way to light the place. Until then you hit your head with the walls and say "ouch!" xD
- Some bad npc, after talking with him, closes you in a arena/pit, where is a big monstrous crazied creature that tries to attack you. The criature has been captive all his live, and is crazy because the long confinment.

Deeper underground:

- Here is a cave that holds a big spider, with the bones of his victims. The level is full of venomous spiders. You have to burn the main spider to retrieve some treasure from his cave, maybe to bring it to the genghis khan-like ghost ?



Outskirts of the tower:

- The tower is sorrounded by quiet and nice gardens/fountains. Maybe some connections here with the undergrounds.

General:

- You can listen at the doors before crossing them. Sometimes you hear complete silence, sometimes you hear ominous sounds.
- When you enter a room, you hear the steps of someone running from you in the distance. You can try to follow him, but maybe it's a trap...

General switch/plates puzzles:

- Long corridor. Two doors. Two plates. Plate 1 opens door2 and closes door1. Plate 2 opens door1 but closes door2. There is a secret switch in a wall, in the
middle of the corridor, that inutilizes the two plates, and leaves the doors open.

       door1   plate1                   plate2   door2     
------------------------------------------------------
-->      |     O                            O        |
------------------------------------------------------

- A door is only opened when some weight is on a plate. When you are on the plate the door opens, but when you walk to the door, it closes (because you stepped off the plate). You must drag some block onto the plate.

- A door is only opened with TWO switches at the same time. You must convince a npc to help you with one switch.

- There is a square room. All the walls are filled of doors. Some are traps, some not.. Some doors make you appear into another door.. xDD


The bar/tavern:

- In some city we need a bar/tabern, with a pretty barmaid, lots of beer.. You can buy beer, food, and buy a room to pass the night... I remember that in Ultima VII part 2 you could also seduce, and spend the night with the barmaid, but maybe this is too much hot for Leo xD



Another idea:

- Shouldn't we call the city Fiorenze insted of Florence?

Credits

- I'll get rid of the credits for the next update and put what jal gives me. They are slowing the game (they're ttfs, with cpu-expensive outlining filters). Will be better with images, jal told me he'll do this and not to worry with the credits : )

Flaw entering buildings/cutting character

- I'll fix this. This was annoying me also for long time, but I did not know what to do. In the last days I ideated a way to fix this, and will program this for the next update! : )

Gipsy camp/Leo house

- Very nice WIP, I like it very much!! : )) Do you plan to have some horses around the gipsies ? And a cat and a dog?

Chris

- I'm very glad you like it! : ) I'll keep working to make this game better and better!!!! I tried the game you post a little bit, it seems interesting (but i haven't seen the movie they are talking about).

- Yes, the coloured blocks are only for debugging (if maybe I miss to draw the collisions of somewhere, i will notice earlier with coloured blocks). Yes, in the definitive version you will can't see them.

Resolution worry

- Thanks for the feedback! I think I'll do the first option, if this is the proportion of screen that jal had in mind when designing the mockup!! : )
- I also think i will put the default option in "normal" or "small"... "big" is too big...

Mona's house

- I'll do it in separate screens for the next update.

Performance

- I'll promise in the next update the game will go faster! : ) This things will be done:
   - Cpu-expensive credits off. Jal new credits on.
   - Default resolution normal or small (smaller screen=faster)
   - Gpu hardware acceleration, switch the game from flash player 8 to flash player 10.

Edited by JaumeAlcazo - 06 December 2010 at 9:30am
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bannanawalrus
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Quote bannanawalrus Replybullet Posted: 06 December 2010 at 10:12am
WOW. yes. WOW. yes. etc...
this is shaping up to be great.
one thing though, you may need to add more colisions, especially in the forest, as at the moment, you can walk on some trees and stuff.Its way better to hit an invisible wall next to it than it is to wind up ontop of it.Apart from that, :D
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Quote jalonso Replybullet Posted: 07 December 2010 at 8:36am
I will make sprites of all kinds for all areas. For now I'm just making 'the world'. Animals, NPCs, and animations will come later or as needed.

I think your ideas are great but I think they are all wrong for this game concept. I can understand a certain level of fantasy but this is a game about Leo and his life, his inventions, his journals and takes place in the Renaissance. Fantasy things like flying in his copter, inventing elevators, Gypsy curses and spells and other things that make some sense I think are all cool. Fighting spiders, worms, spirits doesn't make sense to me. I think quests that focus on inventions and solving puzzles collecting items, journal pages is what this game would be about. Quests and puzzles can all all sorts of complexity to them but keeping an overall focus is needed. Some fighting is cool if it helps the story, otherwise I don't see the need.

The game is called Medici- The DaVinci Journals. Therefore the Journals is the main objective. Leo needs to collect and add pages to the Journals. The villain is Medici who poses the main obstacles for Leo.

I'm not objecting or being all negative about your ideas. I think the appeal to this game would be Leo, his life, his art, his mind.

@ChrisButton, When I originally started the Medici mockup the main question was to design with a TLOZ or Castlevania feel and vibe. TLOZ won out and has indeed been the inspiration for the look, feel and especially perspective of all art. I have been trying hard to give things their own look and not too much of a cheap TLOZ copy...am I failing?
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Quote Ninja Crow Replybullet Posted: 07 December 2010 at 2:18pm
@ jalonso: It is Zelda-like, obviously, but doesn't really look like it. The colours and subjects help give it a unique personality. Although, I do think if someone was matching up the two and trying to find some similarities, your WIP with the gypsy camp is probably the most reminiscent to date -- but that may be the curse of anything even remotely forest-like, post-Zelda. I do think the great-looking curved-front buildings break the 'Zelda-house' silhouette (usually a square), and look the best. Straight rows of pegs are also pretty Zelda-like. But I don't really think you have any cause for concern.

@ JaumeAlcazo: I played your update #7 -- an impressive amount of work. It's looking very good!

I ran all over the place in the game to test it out for you, and I would like to share the things I noticed as I played it. I wanted to point out some bugs, but only to help you as you make this game, not to say anything bad against it (which would be unfair, because I know it is still a work in progress). So I hope these things will be helpful! :)

For reference, I have a Pentium 4, 2.93 GHz with 504 MB of RAM, and an Intel 82915g/gv/910GL with 128 MB.

I'm impressed by how it took only about 8% of the processor when the game was running (according to my WinXP task manager). But as soon as Leo started to move, it would jump up to almost 90%, which made my computer's fan run like crazy. I wouldn't be able to play it with that sound in the background, so maybe the most important thing for your tests of CPU usage would be to try to get it to only take half of that?

I'm also very impressed by how little memory it took to hold the game. Only around 20 MB of my browser was used (I played the SWF) so I was able to run it in a tab very comfortably, even though I had a lot of other things open (my other tabs were definitely using a lot of the page file at that point -- 880 M out of 1225 M at one point -- and still no problem!)

I played it in 'Big', but in 'Normal' there were very obvious splits between the map tiles, as shown in this screenie.

Another thing I noticed is that Leo seems to walk too slowly. I'm not saying he should walk faster, I just notice that it takes a long time to get anywhere. What do you think?

I don't know what you meant by 'Flaw entering buildings/cutting character', but I did notice that when Leo enters or leaves a building, the new screen is shown and then a fade-in effect is put on top of that, making the new area seem to appear twice.

Here's a grab bag of other little things you might want to know about:
  1. In the cathedral, the idling animation for the cardinal is kind of twitchy
  2. Also, the cardinal shifts around as you walk (pic)
  3. And the cardinal isn't solid, so Leo can walk right through him
  4. There seems to be a dark group of extra pixels on Leo's face (pic)
  5. The side frames of the gates should be solid (pic)
  6. It looks like Leo should go behind these library shelves, but he can't (pic)
  7. Shadows go under Leo instead of over him (pic)
  8. It is possible to walk on top of the solidity if you approach it from the side, which then lets you see Leo's feet poking through the 'on top' layer (pic)
  9. And he can overlap the solidity by walking this direction, too (pic)
  10. Leo can stand on top of fence rails (pic)
  11. When Leo walks across stairs, he's slowed down, but he's also slowed down when he walks along them (pic)
  12. As Leo approaches a new map 'segment' you can see the old one run out, with black underneath, before the new one 'pops' into place (pic)
  13. In the cathedral, the shadow layer is put on top of lights on the floor from the windows, even though this light should make the shadows disappear (pic)
  14. Hey, I think I found a secret passage... (pic)
  15. I later found a main path that led to this area, but for a short time I thought the secret passage had let me into an area we weren't supposed to see yet, so I had fun running around in it and doing things like imitating a famous historical character... (pic)
And maybe jalonso wouldn't mind making you some animated candle flames for the chandeliers, and some animated water for the fountains?

So thanks for your hard work (it's been fun so far) and it's going great!

!Strange Atoll - The Amazing Wilbot Game Project!
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Quote jalonso Replybullet Posted: 07 December 2010 at 4:43pm
Here's a grab bag of other little things you might want to know about:

• There seems to be a dark group of extra pixels on Leo's face (pic)
Its in the sprite art and its needed in darker BGs :/

• It looks like Leo should go behind these library shelves, but he can't (pic)
- Its a concession for file size

• Shadows go under Leo instead of over him (pic)
- All shadows are truly pixelled there is nothing transparent or semi transparent in the art. It started out that way and to change this means re-pixelling a lot of stuff. For this reason some things will have shadows and other will not.

• In the cathedral, the shadow layer is put on top of lights on the floor from the windows, even though this light should make the shadows disappear (pic)
- Too late to fix for now at least. Again, all shadows are pixelled. I should have made hybrid art with transparency :/

• And maybe jalonso wouldn't mind making you some animated candle flames for the chandeliers, and some animated water for the fountains?
- Details like that will come later on.
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Quote ChrisButton Replybullet Posted: 07 December 2010 at 10:44pm

@Jalonso,

Despite being a big fan of both the series of TLOZ and Castlevania, I would have definitely chosen TLOZ for this game. The resemblance between your art and TLOZ is undeniable, however this doesn't make your game a cheap copy of TLOZ. You have proven to us in your gallery that your art style is universal, and so by appropriating the artwork of the TLOZ game series you have proven that you can adapt to their style.

I suppose you could confuse this with ripping it off, but if you think about it, I haven't seen any clock towers or cathedrals like yours in any Zelda game, that’s for sure.

From observation, I would say you’ve taken two fundamentals from the Minish Cap specifically. Throughout the sprited games, the art crews have constantly updated their technique, and it appears they have finalized it in that game as it was their last sprited game before changing to 3d models, whether it was a third person game or not.

The first element being the bird’s eye perspective where it seems like all the walls are slanting outwards. This is good for you as an artist because you can saturate every building with as much art as you possibly can before needing to draw things in a 3d program. So by doing this, you can draw on all 4 walls instead of just the one facing downwards. The second would be another perspective element, this time for outside buildings, unlike the first element which was inside. This element involves the base of a building beginning slightly towards the middle of the building, which then as you go up the building the outer walls begin to slant outwards, creating the illusion of overhead depth, although I’m not sure if that one was as intentional as the first.

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Quote JaumeAlcazo Replybullet Posted: 09 December 2010 at 9:14am
Hello all!!

@Ninja Crow
I'm very glad you took the time to play the game and test it in so exhaustive way! : ) I'm also glad you like it and noticed the amount of work done!! : ) Thank you very much for all the reporting, because I was completelly unware of some things! I'll try to fix the maximum possible things for the next update, and discuss them point per point, and graphically, as you did (great idea!!!) : )

For curiosity, can you tell me please the name of the program you used to capture animated gifs from the game?

The issue with Leo speed also worries me.

At the moment I see 2 possible solutions:

- Make Leo go faster.
- Make Leo have an ability, which temporaly makes him go faster. For example, in Zelda Link to the past, you could run. In minish cap, you could roll, to make you go faster.

Making Leo roll would be weird, I think, maybe make him run for a little while, when you press some key?

Of course the two things could be done. Increase slightly the base speed, and give him the ability to run.

@bananawalrus

Thanks for the bug reporting and for your very kind words! I'll add the collisions in the forest for the next update (it ran out of time for the current one) : )

@jalonso

Don't worry, I think I let my mind go a little bit when thinking about the fantasy ideas, and ended too much fantasy xD You are right, they are shifting too much from the subject of the game, so I park them for another game!

By the way, can I use the Medici Castle you send me as a placeholder or better wait the another update? Will the structure change too much?

I'm already working on the next update, will add the start screen.

Today I did the typewriter effect, when talking with the pope, as can be seen in many rpgs.

Edited by JaumeAlcazo - 09 December 2010 at 9:16am
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Quote Ninja Crow Replybullet Posted: 09 December 2010 at 12:28pm
@ JaumeAlcazo:

I make the animations in GIMP, by having one frame per layer, and then exporting as a GIF. But it seems to be much the same process in Photoshop, as shown in this animated GIF tutorial I found.

I thought of a 'run' or 'dash' button, also, but I wasn't sure if mentioning it would narrow down the possible responses -- in case someone had a different idea. Being an old guy, it would make sense if Leo could only dash for a short time, and had to walk normally for a minute before he could dash again. But again, that's assuming that a dash button is a good solution (I've never tried to design a game in which the hero would look silly rushing about, so I've never thought of what else could be done).

I'm glad to hear about the new text box system! But rather than pester you with questions about how you have it working, I'll post this terrific text box tutorial from a cool guy whose programming tips have been invaluable to me. Since it lists all the exact ways that I think text boxes should work, you can just tell me what parts you agree or disagree with. :)

!Strange Atoll - The Amazing Wilbot Game Project!
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Quote ChrisButton Replybullet Posted: 10 December 2010 at 8:14pm

Would be cool to meet the makers of the game, in game. "Hey I'm Jaume, and I programmed this game!" and "Hey I'm Jal, and I drew this game!" or something hahah.

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Quote JaumeAlcazo Replybullet Posted: 14 December 2010 at 10:59am
@Ninja Crow

Thanks for the tutorials and ideas! I printed all of them (code ninjas) and are very nice. I will read them. I readed some of the text box tutorial and has good ideas, like autosplitting the text.

At the moment, my text box shows you character by character the text (40 characters per second) and if you press "A" at any moment before it has showed all the characters, then it shows the full phrase at once. It's a pretty standard textbox rpg behaviour.

@Chris

Hahaha it's a weird idea! But maybe jal or myself, or anyone of you could make a cameo as some npc, or shopper, in the game ; )

Next update

After some days off, I keep working on the next update. I hope to give you something by Christmas, or by the end of the year, as a Christmas present ; )

Edited by JaumeAlcazo - 14 December 2010 at 11:00am
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Quote bannanawalrus Replybullet Posted: 14 December 2010 at 11:04am
@chris and jaume, that would actually be really cool!

jal: do you like my handiwork?
you: you built this?
jal: No, but i drew it!
you: your an architect?
jal: *sigh* nevermind...
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Quote ChrisButton Replybullet Posted: 15 December 2010 at 5:35am
hahah! If Jal wants to, I'll draw him a little something of what I look like, and he can change it into the game style. Totally up to him! Next game should have PJ people in it! haha
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Quote jeremy Replybullet Posted: 15 December 2010 at 7:11am
jal would absolutely have to be a massive Scarab :>

I've been watching this closely, fantastic work by you both :D
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Quote bannanawalrus Replybullet Posted: 15 December 2010 at 9:24am
^haha! in a dungeon! he could point you the right way:)
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Quote zi-double Replybullet Posted: 17 December 2010 at 5:29pm
Just to say my admirations :)

grey stone flooring look at great, but in map area for me stones are very big and not fit very well. This isn't problem. First what I see are chimneys in map area - please make different, not like box. Maybe coaches can make a bit smaller for better fit in the map. They easy can repair, because have some pixels unnecessary forn the length.

Great project and carry great inspiration ...
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Quote jalonso Replybullet Posted: 23 December 2010 at 12:23pm
Originally posted by zi-double

Just to say my admirations :)



Originally posted by zi-double

grey stone flooring look at great, but in map area for me stones are very big and not fit very well. This isn't problem.

I agree and notice this too. This was all TLOZ inspired and Zelda games have those inconsistencies so I have embraced them.

Originally posted by zi-double

First what I see are chimneys in map area - please make different, not like box.

This detail kills me and it really stands out to me too (always has). This project has been just for fun and I'm trying to be true to my mockup and those chimneys are on there so I hope it only bother me and you. While this may look like an easy project its actually quite large and involved so I'm trying not to revise anything unless its detrimental.

Originally posted by zi-double

Maybe coaches can make a bit smaller for better fit in the map. They easy can repair, because have some pixels unnecessary forn the length.

Language problem! I don't understand this comment :(

Originally posted by zi-double

Great project and carry great inspiration ...

I <3 U 2 :D
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Quote Lochie Replybullet Posted: 24 December 2010 at 4:07am
I feel terrible for only supplying enthusiasm to a project as beautiful as this... I have never been as impressed and excited by this game, nor do I expect that to change!

Best of luck, everything looks amazing.
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Quote jalonso Replybullet Posted: 24 December 2010 at 9:50am
@Lochie and everyone who follows this thread. I have no problem if anyone wants to make a sprite, a portrait, cutscene, music, write puzzles, storylines or whatever else. So long as the art matches in style I'm cool if others want to add stuff to it.
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Quote bannanawalrus Replybullet Posted: 24 December 2010 at 11:07am
Just out of intrest, is there really any storyline decided yet. I see it being solving puzzles etc in order to get parts for inventions or do other stuff that he did, but it feels like there needs to be some kinda bigger story arc. One idea(ripped from AC brotherhood) is someone makes leonardo build his war machines(not the borgia, as its set in florence) and then he has to destroy them. It is very similar to AC but it would be cool nonetheless. Id love to be able to contribute more but i dont know enough about the time period. I'll do some research on cool historic events that happened/ could have happened and get back to you.
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Quote jalonso Replybullet Posted: 24 December 2010 at 1:15pm
My general thought on storyline is that Leo gets summoned to Florence by Medici (the villain). He has some master plan (world domination, take over the church for evil purposes or whatever) and is trying to trick Leo into getting this done. While this unfolds other side quests present themselves (collection badges, journals, etc.). He must invent stuff to get things done or make progress. Puzzles are hurdles and obstacles... I don't really know about any of this. If someone can write and is into history it would be awesome if they joined in.

For example, the GUI system is unplanned by me because there isn't much of a storyline to follow. I don't even know if what Leo holds is a staff or a wand. I have these collection screen titles but some could be better and others may just be wrong for DaVinci or the time period (Renaissance (1400-1500). Of course its a game and a fantasy so historial accuracy shouldn't be that important just 'kinda there' :/

*I was never planning to make this a real project so other than its been fun to make maps and tiles, I'm working blind.
EDIT:
** This is obviously a much bigger project than it seemed at first so I totally think this 'phase' should all take place in Florence and the end game is Leo finishing the Vincopter flying thing and escapes...maybe with MonaLisa ;) ??? Travel to other cities are expansion packs or updates later on...much later on.



Edited by jalonso - 24 December 2010 at 1:15pm
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Quote bannanawalrus Replybullet Posted: 25 December 2010 at 11:30am
Agree. confine it to florence for now. However, a major flaw in your story is that Leo was extremely good friends with lorenzo medici, so it wouldnt make sense to have him manipulate da vinci. unless Lorenzo was replaced by an impostor and leo has to build some inventions in order to rescue the real medici. or something:)
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Quote jalonso Replybullet Posted: 25 December 2010 at 2:49pm
Originally posted by bannanawalrus

...unless Lorenzo was replaced by an impostor and leo has to build some inventions in order to rescue the real medici...


That's a good idea. Hopefully someone will want join in to help develop the storyline *wink, wink*
_____________
I hated that whole farmland, gypsy camp area so I've ditched it.
I am moving the gypsy camp to the gate northwest of Florence all on its own. Kinda boxy looking but I like it. I wil add loads of colorful/carnival type stuff, plus some horses and dancing gypsies and other stuffs???
Ideas + c + c + c welcome.
Here Leo gets his furtune told by the fortune teller (inside front facing wagon), who also helps Leo know what he should do next (rpg classic thang).
Maybe Leo needs to do some task for some random gypsy in the market area before the fortune teller wagon even opens up??? Leo could also get the 'crystal wand' from this area???
Also I thought there could be a mini game here for Leo to gets random prizes depending on how much money or 'lira' he bets (if Liras existed during the Renaissance). The mini game is that top empty area. Whatever he wins pops up on the right hand side. I think this all depends on the programmer and his powers.
One of these games



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Quote bannanawalrus Replybullet Posted: 25 December 2010 at 4:14pm
Just lost a massive post, which im kinda happy for, seeing as i was making it up as i went along and as such it would have been very confusing:)

anyway, story ideas. The game is set in leo's old age. He is looking forward to returning to the city where he DID spend most of his youth. You go there and do some commisions, inventions etc., perhaps some kind of humerous(spelling fail) side plot involving the church harrasing him because of his chronic procrastination, this could continue throughout thegame, with various lowly church people being sent to harass him.Infact, the ending cutscene could be him having a well deserved relax, then there is a knock at the door, and its a priest, come to see about the paintings he ordered a year ago!

anyway, soon after arriving, your dear friend lorenzo medici, who you had not seen in a VERY long time, invites you to his palace.It all goes well but you are slightly off put by th efact he enquires about your war machines. You politely refuse, but one day, whilst you are going about your business, the plans are stolen, and there is seemingly no clue as to where they have gone. you are worried, but when nothing else happens, you conclude the theif did not know their true worth, and discarded them.
Suddenly, however, news arrives of (a historical army) approaching to lay seige to florence. Lorenzo tells you this is why he wanted the machines, but he did nto want to worry you unduly, and now would you please build them. You notice when you tell him of the stolen plans he does not seem too surprised.However, you agree to build them from memory(perhaps you have to see people, etc, in order to remember the mechanisms(flashbacks?)). Lorenzo uses them to drive away the army, and you do not see them again. However, you uncover a lead that, after the appropriate amount of talking, inventions, puzzles etc leads you to the thief of the blueprints. Or rather, thieves, a whole organised guild of them, working for none other than who appears to be lorenzo medici. You overhear them saying they were unable to build the designs, but lorenzo says, it doesnt matter, the ruse with the false seige worked, he has the machines. He also inquires as to the state of "his doppelganger" or something similar, hinting that they will not need him much longer. You are troubled, and go to confront lorenzo at his palace, but there are too many guards and you are captured and sent to prison. While you are there you are nextdoor to the real lorenzo in the cells(convenient, huh) and he fills you in on the impostor, and his (as yet undecided) sinister purpose for the machines. You escape using your gadgets and steal the war machine, freeing lorenzo and escaping before destroying the machine. Something else can happen here, perhaps you have to convince the army of the real lorenzo or something, but anyway, the day is saved:) go team:)

Other notes:

this could probably be made to fit with history.There must have been a siege on florence at some point, for example.

These are just random musings, if you dont like them, say so.Its not like ive spent hours formulating this or anything.

Since this is fairly open ended, there is alot of potential for more "chapters" as it were:)

WOW.... BIG TEXT WALL:)

Edited by bannanawalrus - 25 December 2010 at 4:15pm
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Quote JaumeAlcazo Replybullet Posted: 26 December 2010 at 3:25pm
Hi, i'm in hurry, so I can't read all the story by bannana, but I will!

Only to tell you that now Leo can wander all around the Medici's Castle, with all the 3 levels, with slowers in the stairs, collisions, and the "over everything" layer, on every level.

There are also 2 doors, one in level1 and one in level2 that open automatically when Leo approaches them.

There is a door in level1 that seems to lead nowhere, (the one in the middle), so I leaved this untouched.

The door next right to this leads to the same room as the far right door in level 1, but I made it openable anyways.

When you press "c" key the "Collection" screen smoothly fades in and Leo is halted anywhere he is. Now you can go around the collection screen with the arrow keys, with the square for selecting objects, only that for the moment there is no object in the collection. Thanks for the gui jalonso!

This weeks i did more things, the full list of improvements will come with update 8, which I promised will be by the end of this year, very soon! I hope to post it in time! ; )

Jal, the first screen tells "shutterstock", and I can't view the image.

Talk to you soon!

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Quote JaumeAlcazo Replybullet Posted: 27 December 2010 at 7:32am
@bannanawalrus:

I read the story and it's very cool, it's ok for me :)

Just a thought: I feel this game needs, in the dialogs and situations, the kind of humor that is seen on monkey1, 2 and 3.

By the way, the betting-minigame is an interesting idea!

Edited by JaumeAlcazo - 27 December 2010 at 7:36am
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Quote PixelEtsu Replybullet Posted: 27 December 2010 at 8:40am
Not want to be mean or rude but it disturbs me a lot the way you make things.....they look all cool but they're perspective is not the same....to me it just disturbs the whole look of the game =/ Example: Columns in the first page compared to the doors,clearly different,even if its because the columns are taller the perspective is different.(columns look like we looking more Up)
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Quote jalonso Replybullet Posted: 27 December 2010 at 10:27am
Originally posted by PixelEtsu

Not want to be mean or rude but it disturbs me a lot the way you make things.....they look all cool but they're perspective is not the same....to me it just disturbs the whole look of the game =/ Example: Columns in the first page compared to the doors,clearly different,even if its because the columns are taller the perspective is different.(columns look like we looking more Up)

This is unavoidable and is not the way I make things, just this project. This is based on TLOZ - Minish Cap perspectives and has the same visual problems that game has. I've removed all front angles and will use no doors to the right or left to minimize the visual inconsistencies as much as possible. Some wierd things like you mention will still happen, especially in any interior view. This whole project has been way harder than you can imagine to layout.
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Quote greenraven Replybullet Posted: 27 December 2010 at 11:17am
Yeah, I kinda mentioned that from the very beginning.

Anyway, I don't really have anything constructive to say but I thought I'd drop in with a support post. Keep going you two, looks awesome! ^_^
"pwnage comes with patience, practice and planning." ~ Jalonso   
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Quote jalonso Replybullet Posted: 29 December 2010 at 5:35pm
Kinda stuck with the gypsy map so I made the interior for the wagon where the fortune teller is. She will help Leo find his way in the game. I may change to card reader as Zelda has a fortune teller (which I forgot about).

Placed other portraits for easy c+c. Still going for that somewhat cute portraits but that kinda look like paintings from the Renaissance too.
Quicky screen mockup to view portrait in context.



Edited by jalonso - 29 December 2010 at 5:36pm
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Quote zi-double Replybullet Posted: 29 December 2010 at 6:29pm

in my previous post when I talk for wagons. I dislike this ladders only in front view of the wagons, because wagons can have exit from everywhere. You remove gypsy camp from map with buildings and now scale without buildings is good, but I was made some changes to show for what I talk in previous post :)



very nice new inside view ... If you make different entrances of the wagond than you will have different inside view and player will be better orientated where is he in which wagon.

Gypsy camp look at very clear. I'm not see so clear gypsys. In Bulgaria I see such camps and they look at very different ... I'm kidding :)


Edited by zi-double - 29 December 2010 at 6:36pm
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Quote ChrisButton Replybullet Posted: 29 December 2010 at 10:46pm
I dig the creeper lady Jal, keep it up! I got something coming up for you guys
to look at soon. Relates strongly to this game project.
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Quote JaumeAlcazo Replybullet Posted: 30 December 2010 at 8:23am
Update 8 preview

Hello!

I've just registered a hosting with domain name www.jaumealcazo.com for my personal page, and to upload things there, (IT STILL DOESN'T WORK, WE SHOULD WAIT FOR DNS PROPAGATION AND FOR I UPLOAD SOMETHING THERE : p )

I'm almost ready, this update features many new things. I leave you with a couple of screenshots.

Update 8, very very soon, stay tuned!









Thanks all for the kind and support words : ) UPDATE 8 VERY SOON! AND PLAYABLE DIRECTLY ON THE BROWSER!


Edited by JaumeAlcazo - 30 December 2010 at 8:39am
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Quote JaumeAlcazo Replybullet Posted: 31 December 2010 at 9:34am
Update 8

Ok, just in time, a few hours before the year ends.. Here comes, UPDATE 8!

Play it at:

http://www.jaumealcazo.com

Things done in this update:

1. Now you can bring up the collection screen if you press "c" anytime! : ) You can move the cursor with the arrow keys. You can visit the objects, the wands, the gear, and the squares that are right the gear. The cursor blinks. You can go out this screen by pressing "c" another time. At the moment you can't pick any object.



2. Medici's Castle with all his glorious 3 levels, with collisions and the over everything layer : )









3. Now you can enter the basement of the Library.





4. I dropped the old "movie style" credits at the beginning. Now you can bring up the credits by pressing "i" at any moment in the game (the "i" is after "info", because the "c" is already taken by "collection"). Now the game should work faster, because the old credits were taking too much cpu (antialiased fonts, with cpu-expensive filters... motion tweens with alpha changes.. too much cpu I think. We always can return to old credits, but better exchange the fonts for pngs (in this way you precalculate everything instead of doing it on the fly)).



5. **edited - switched back to "high", because fonts in dialogs were displaying too poorly***(((I put *your* Flash Player in "low quality" by default. So in this way the game should work faster without any quality loss, because almost everything is done with .gifs ))

6. You remember the dilemma between showing more map or be true to original screen proportions by jalonso? I decided respect the original proportions. And of course, this means the game is faster, because we are showing less map in smaller resolutions. *Now I always show the exact amount of screen that jalonso intended to show in first place*.

7. Now the default resolution is bit smaller (before was too big for me). And also I changed the names of the resolutions and added some recommendations.



8. Typewriter effect when you are talking with npcs. It draws 1 character per frame. The game runs at 40fps, so it draws 40 characters per second. You can press "A" to make it show the phrase at once.



9. Now the bishop and all the sprites and npcs move well, exactly at the same time the map moves. It's a bug detected by Ninja Crow, it's explained better below.

10. The base speed of Leo is raised from 5 to 7.5 (Ninja Crow and me too detected that Leo was walking too slow)

11. Leo can now run or dash!!! You only need to press "A" while walking. At the moment, and for debugging purposes, there's no countdown, and Leo can dash forever without fainting or exhaustion.

12. Better collisions outside the Cathedral (more accurate). The bushes outside the Cathedral are now sprites, and I coded the so *THEY ARE DRAWED IN THE RIGHT Z-DEPTH DEPENDING ON LEO'S Y COORDINATE*. Notice in the image how the first bush is drawed *ABOVE* Leo and the bush in the middle is drawed *BELOW* Leo : )



13. I did a loader, so now we can play the game online without downloading it ^_^ *happy* *happy* : )



14. Now I discriminate between vertical and horizontal stairs. It's a bug detected by Ninja Crow, explained better below.

15. Minor fixing of some collisions inside the cathedral, around the benchs, (now you can get closer to the wall, as pictured).



16. Remember that weird 2 screens y-scroll on Mona Lisa's house? Now I splitted her house in two rooms.





17. Two automatically openable doors in Medici's Castle, one in level 1 and the another one on level 2.





18. Collisions for *ALL* the forest done. I put new forest that jal gave me (more "boxy"). Still lacks the "over everything" layer and the collisions should be more refined, but that will come with the time. There is also a "secret passage" bug, that I dare you to find ; ) (i'll fix the passage in the next update).





19. The statues at the beginning of the Cathedral now are drawed above Leo, that was a bug that no one noticed! Also fixed minor collisions around the railings. Right now I see one more bug, the level marker "level 01" is drawed below the pope, and it should be drawed above : P I'll fix that on the next update, remember me just in case I forget! : )



20. New entrance point, with the ship, etc... There is also a guard here, you can talk with him : )













21. The game runs now in Flash Player 10 and uses LEVEL 2 HARDWARE ACCELERATION - GPU.

Fixed Bugs (reported by Ninja Crow):


2. Also, the cardinal shifts around as you walk.




2. Fixed bug. Now the npcs and sprites move exactly at the same time as the map does.


3. And the cardinal isn't solid, so Leo can walk right through him.


3. Fixed bug. Added some subtle solidity to the pope (you can collide with him if you hit his feet, but not if you hit his head).


5. The side frames of the gates should be solid.




5. Fixed bug. I closed all the gates in Florence exterior that Leo can't go through for the moment.


8. It is possible to walk on top of the solidity if you approach it from the side, which then lets you see Leo's feet poking through the 'on top' layer.




8. Fixed bug.


9. And he can overlap the solidity by walking this direction, too.




9. Fixed bug. This is an extremely sensitive part of the code (collision detection with Leo) and I don't dare to touch it too much, so I only moved 2pixels left Leo inside the gif in which he was facing down (he was not centered when facing down). Now the effect should be minimized but maybe not solved completely. Check again please and tell me how it's feeling.

When solving this I found another bug that went unnoticed. When walking up or down, along a wall, if you press against the wall, you can enter a little bit in the wall. For example if you are walking up, along a wall you have in your right, and you press right while you are pressing up, you will be able to enter a little bit in the wall.

It's a pretty tiny effect, If no one finds this annoying, I will not fix it. Tell me what do you think please.


10. Leo can stand on top of fence rails (pic)




10. Fixed bug.


11. When Leo walks across stairs, he's slowed down, but he's also slowed down when he walks along them.




11. Fixed bug. Now I discriminate between vertical and horizontal stairs.


12. As Leo approaches a new map 'segment' you can see the old one run out, with black underneath, before the new one 'pops' into place.




12. Fixed bug. Now this kind of things is hidden and runs "behind the scenes".


14. Hey, I think I found a secret passage... (pic)

15. I later found a main path that led to this area, but for a short time I thought the secret passage had let me into an area we weren't supposed to see yet, so I had fun running around in it and doing things like imitating a famous historical character... (pic)






14 and 15. Lol xD Fixed... In the forest there is still a "secret passage" not supposed to be there, that I'll fix on the next update, see if you can find it! ; )

- Bugs 4,6,7, 13 were already answered by jalonso.

About the cpu usage, and other things Ninja Crow says, I'll try to fix them in the future, thank you very much for the time took trying the game! : )

Not fixed Bugs (reported by Ninja Crowd):


1. In the cathedral, the idling animation for the cardinal is kind of twitchy


1. I leave this for the future, I tried to change that, and played a little bit with the code that triggers the animations at random, but I didn't find anything conclusive, I'll review this on the future.

Conclusion

Wow, seeing it now, I think I worked pretty hard on this update : ) Now it's the time for some partying : P

2011 it's only a few hours ago here in Spain!!!

HAPPY NEW YEAR!!!! ; )

REMEMBER LEO NOW CAN DASH BY PRESSING "A"!

Edited by JaumeAlcazo - 31 December 2010 at 10:21am
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Quote Stratto Replybullet Posted: 31 December 2010 at 4:00pm
WOW
that's all I can say. that update post is seriously something!
A few bugs I found: you can walk over some people, main player sprite should have a dash animation instead of just making walking faster, it doesn't look natural.


Edited by Stratto - 31 December 2010 at 4:03pm
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Quote jalonso Replybullet Posted: 31 December 2010 at 4:34pm
Looking terrific.
The bugs I found are normal at this stage. I found nothing critical.
The Leo dashing option is a perfect place for a Leo invention...a JetPack or Segway type scooter...a skateboard...rollerblades...something fun and cool and totally unbelievable. At first you must be oldie man walking and after a while he can invent the fast moving skill.
For now just let him be as a placeholder. The Leo sprite may change when I make the portrait anyhow.
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Quote ChrisButton Replybullet Posted: 01 January 2011 at 2:26am
Update 8 already?! That's great you two. I'm glad to see the new additions and look forward to exploring them later! I'll write you guys a review after I have a proper play through ;-)
 
Keep up the good work!
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Quote JaumeAlcazo Replybullet Posted: 06 January 2011 at 8:07am
Jal, reviewing the thread, I see the Last Supper is done, but I can't find the .psd in my mail, could you send it to me please? Cheers.
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Quote jalonso Replybullet Posted: 07 January 2011 at 6:04pm
Bored of world tiles...
Tweaked gypsy and new Leo and the Cardinal portraits WIPs.
c+c

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Quote carbontwelve Replybullet Posted: 08 January 2011 at 6:06am
every time i come back here, this gets a little more awesome!
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Quote Psychotic_Carp Replybullet Posted: 09 January 2011 at 8:49am
Originally posted by carbontwelve

every time i come back here, this gets a little more awesome!


I agree!!! I havent read the whole thread, any chance of theis getting on the iphone/ipod touch or android?
got game?
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Quote ChrisButton Replybullet Posted: 09 January 2011 at 8:47pm
Originally posted by Psychotic_Carp

I agree!!! I havent read the whole thread, any chance of theis getting on the iphone/ipod touch or android?
At the moment, it is unlikely as the game is still currently under development. Can you play SWF files on an iPod?
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Quote jalonso Replybullet Posted: 11 January 2011 at 7:40pm
c+c
remade leo (not heroic looking) and the cardinal (too boring)

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Quote cure Replybullet Posted: 11 January 2011 at 9:23pm
i still think lorenzo's upper lip disappears when he's angry.

nitpick time!

leo: ear farther back, slightly taller cranium? hair seems to sit flush with head as well.
monk: larger ear. the purple in the skin isn't really working imo
dude/guard: love 'em, guard especially.
new cardinal: short upper lip, but i think it works fine here to emphasize his puckered look.
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Quote jeremy Replybullet Posted: 11 January 2011 at 9:35pm
Heh, that cardinal looks great :D

I made an edit of Leo, I think your beard is a bit fluffy, bordering on pillowish, whereas that red chalk self portrait he did has a really scraggly one. He doesn't really have much of a moustache over the top lip. I somehow made him look like Liam Neeson D:


Lorenzo Angry's mouth is still reading a bit as a sneer rather than angriness. Perhaps the corners of the mouth should be turned down a bit more, and the creases from the nose->mouth accentuated/moved.

Everything else is fab, are you still using the same palette as back in the original Medeci thread? :)
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Quote Lochie Replybullet Posted: 12 January 2011 at 4:03am
Much prefer the "scraggly" beard for Leo, and love the new Cardinal.

Can't wait for the Drew Barrymore portrait for when Leonardo helps her marry Prince Charming. #everafterreference

Looking wonderful!
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