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CELS
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Quote CELS Replybullet Topic: Robed character
    Posted: 08 September 2011 at 12:14pm
I've already posted this in the challenge thread, but I'm posting it here because I'm hoping that someone can help me with the anatomy and I don't want to totally hijack the challenge thread. I'd really like to improve upon it, as I can see it doesn't look quite right, but I don't know how to fix it.



Any feedback is welcome, but I'm particularly concerned with the face and the hands.
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GreyScale
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Quote GreyScale Replybullet Posted: 08 September 2011 at 12:22pm
Well, his left hand doesn't seem quite right. With that hand position and that large of a sphere, it would probably roll right off. Consider when trying to hold that large of an object how the thumb goes back. In addition, the fingers seem to line up a little too well, which seem unnatural. Getting rid of the highlight on that arm would probably help too (it doesn't make sense with the light source, as far as I can tell). As far as the face goes, it would be interesting to see it more in shadow.

I can't really help much, though, being new to pixeling and all.
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Lathien
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Quote Lathien Replybullet Posted: 08 September 2011 at 12:54pm
I made an edit, I think it will help:

Mainly I just tried to illuminate the face a bit more, especially the nose and cheek area and I worked on adding light to the orb hand, in particular the thumb, as I figured that when the far side of the sphere gets lighter because of refraction, that would also light up the thumb. Oh and the forehead I worked on too, getting rid of some lines over our left eye to add in an illuminated ridge for an eyebrow.
I wouldn't know dithering so I can't help on the orb but I suggest you apply the same pattern that you have around the candle to really make the orb pop.
Oh and you were missing a fingernail on the right-hand thumb.
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Quote CELS Replybullet Posted: 09 September 2011 at 2:11am
Originally posted by GreyScale

Well, his left hand doesn't seem quite right.

Oh, feck. I was hoping that it would look like a woman. Did you just assume that it was a man because there isn't any visible hair, or does the face have some masculine features I can fix?

Originally posted by GreyScale

With that hand position and that large of a sphere, it would probably roll right off. Consider when trying to hold that large of an object how the thumb goes back. In addition, the fingers seem to line up a little too well, which seem unnatural. Getting rid of the highlight on that arm would probably help too (it doesn't make sense with the light source, as far as I can tell). As far as the face goes, it would be interesting to see it more in shadow.

Thanks, that's very helpful indeed. You are quite right. That'll teach me to draw hands without using references. I've tried to follow your advice, it still doesn't look quite right, I think.

Originally posted by GreyScale

I can't really help much, though, being new to pixeling and all.

Well, this thread isn't about pixelling technique as much as anatomy, originally.


Originally posted by Lathien

I made an edit, I think it will help:
Mainly I just tried to illuminate the face a bit more, especially the nose and cheek area and I worked on adding light to the orb hand, in particular the thumb, as I figured that when the far side of the sphere gets lighter because of refraction, that would also light up the thumb. Oh and the forehead I worked on too, getting rid of some lines over our left eye to add in an illuminated ridge for an eyebrow.

Thanks for taking the time to do an edit. It's funny that you suggested illuminating the face more, whilst GreyScale suggested adding more shade. I have to say, my intention was to leave half the face in (relative) shadow, but I'm having trouble deciding whether or not that's realistic with this light source. Regardles, I think you did some good things with the forehead and left side of the face.

Originally posted by Lathien

I wouldn't know dithering so I can't help on the orb but I suggest you apply the same pattern that you have around the candle to really make the orb pop.
Oh and you were missing a fingernail on the right-hand thumb.

Indeed!  I haven't really started working on the orb, but I have seen some great orbs in the PJ gallery that I intend to imitate.




Edited by CELS - 09 September 2011 at 4:03am
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Quote GreyScale Replybullet Posted: 09 September 2011 at 1:21pm
Hmm...The hand is a lot better, but something still seems off in the thumb area. It could partially be that the "orb" is not round, but I dunno.

I assumed it was male, I think, because of the width and stiffness of the shoulders, which is in large part due to the robes shape. Now that you mention it, however, I can see from the facial shape that it is female. It can be hard to tell in pixel art because you have so little space to work with, and I think that the shape and detail you've managed to put in the face with so little room to work is remarkable.
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Quote CELS Replybullet Posted: 09 September 2011 at 5:41pm
Thanks, GreyScale! I've tried to improve it further.



I haven't been successful with the lantern. It doesn't really appear to be casting light, as it is right now. Will experiment further.


Edited by CELS - 09 September 2011 at 8:04pm
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Lathien
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Quote Lathien Replybullet Posted: 10 September 2011 at 4:44am
I think you need to add the dithering light effect in front of the lantern box and really make the non-glass parts bright to make it look like it's casting light.
And because you have a lighter band on the opposite side of the orb, I think you should draw the thumb just next to the index finger using the orb's palette, so it looks like the orb is transparent and you can see the thumb behind it.
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Quote Qemist Replybullet Posted: 10 September 2011 at 4:47am
Working with light is really hard. I love the challenge idea and so far the WIP's are looking good. Yet again I love your art you gain knowledge so fast it is rediculous.

Keep up the good work Cels!

Edit: forgot to mention that I really like the texture of the wall, especially the bit at the front wich you put alot of detail into.


Edited by Qemist - 10 September 2011 at 11:48am
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Quote CELS Replybullet Posted: 10 September 2011 at 2:16pm
Thanks a lot for your help, guys! Much appreciated.

@Lathien: I've tried to do as you said, but I'm not sure if it worked. What do you think? I added a thumb on the far side of the orb, but it's barely visible.
@Gemist: Thanks, I must have spent a few hours now drawing and redrawing the light from the lantern using different techniques. This latest version is the most acceptable.


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Quote Qemist Replybullet Posted: 10 September 2011 at 2:39pm
I like the light alot more but it should defenitly fade out one way or another. I think it should be much brighter outside of the lantern too. That might change alot. Verry impressive progress I dont think I could do it myself or maybe I'm just too lazy :)
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Quote Miumau0 Replybullet Posted: 10 September 2011 at 3:41pm
max color count to challenge is 32, your piece got over 40.

Well, i would change the light coming from candle more yellowish. Add yellow highlights to face. Also add some blue to all shades. And maybe the eyes could reflect light.

also made little edit for the face.



Edited by Miumau0 - 10 September 2011 at 3:45pm
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Quote CELS Replybullet Posted: 10 September 2011 at 4:58pm
Well, that's all kinds of awesome. Thanks a million, I'll play around with it some more. I have one more day before the challenge ends, anyway.

Now, I've started experimenting with your suggestions. I'm having a bit of a "moral dilemma" in terms of how closely I can mimic your edit. After all, you've barely changed my work, except switching some colours around. I can't really follow your advice except by copying it.

Does the lantern light look better?



@Qemist: Definitely too lazy ;)


Edited by CELS - 10 September 2011 at 5:05pm
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Quote Miumau0 Replybullet Posted: 10 September 2011 at 5:08pm
lol, started make little edit to the robes colors. I may post another edit later. And nice to hear if you liked my face edit :o

I would make the lanters light brighter. :) Looking good :)


Edited by Miumau0 - 10 September 2011 at 5:15pm
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Quote GreyScale Replybullet Posted: 10 September 2011 at 5:13pm
I love the way you colored the orb: it looks really pretty. I also like the changes in the color you emulated from Miumau, though I haven't the slightest clue what the commonly accepted morality on the matter would be. the light definitely looks better in orange, but for the amount of light that it's casting seems like it might still be a little low?

I still find the shading on the mantle of the robe to be a little distracting in how straight the lines on the left are: it doesn't feel like cloth, and doesn't quite seem consistent with how the light is hitting her face.
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Quote CELS Replybullet Posted: 11 September 2011 at 3:35am
@Miumau0: Thanks! Tried to make the lantern light even brighter, but I had to resort to dithering due to the colour restriction, so I'm not sure if it's working.

@GreyScale: Thanks a lot. Do you suggest having less ripples / lines on the left side of the mantle?

I got one comment from the gallery concerning the eyes, which made me think a bit. There are so few pixels to work with at this scale, so there aren't too many options. Still, I'm not sure.
EDIT: On reflection, the comment may have been referring to the eyes in the background, but it still made me think.




Edited by CELS - 11 September 2011 at 4:19am
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Quote neofotistou Replybullet Posted: 11 September 2011 at 4:32am
I just saw this one. Anatomy-wise, the hand cluitching the ball is a lot bigger than the hand clutching the staff. Also, it would help your composition if you lowered the hand with the sphere to be on the bottom right interest point (remember the rule of thirds?)

You're getting there
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Quote Alex Pang Replybullet Posted: 11 September 2011 at 4:35am
The eyes in the background are fine, I was referring to the eyes on the wizard.
try to make the eyes more solid shapes rather broken up by stuff.
And maybe make one eye darker then another.
The mouth is rather hard to read, I'm not sure if shes smiling or dying of pain, lol.
Might I recommend to remove the outline from the robbes too, because It makes it look like leather!
But good work are you from Norway, BTW?
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Quote Miumau0 Replybullet Posted: 11 September 2011 at 6:06am
Heres fast edit what i was thinking about what you could do to the robe and eyes on BG.

also editet right hand little.


Edited by Miumau0 - 11 September 2011 at 6:06am
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Quote Qemist Replybullet Posted: 11 September 2011 at 6:38am
nice edit good shadows 
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Quote Alex Pang Replybullet Posted: 11 September 2011 at 6:46am
This one has two light sources....
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Quote CELS Replybullet Posted: 11 September 2011 at 10:51am
@Neo: Thanks for the advice. Honestly, I was worried that the clenched hand was larger than the hand holding the orb. Maybe you're right though, I'll have a look at it. And yeah, I remember the rule of thirds. I just didn't think to apply it to a portrait. Slow learner, remember? :)

@ Alex: Good point about the outlines. They weren't that obvious before I changed the darkest shade to a bluer hue, but they're really bad right now. Having looked at the different options for eyes, I don't like any of them. The top one looks too asian, the two middle ones look too cartoony and the bottom one doesn't work at all. I rather like their complexity, so I don't mind that they're "broken up by stuff". They're not regular human eyes anyway. In regards to the mouth, I find that it usually works to paint a mouth like a really wide M, as the top lip protrudes at the center. But I guess at this scale, it doesn't really work, so I'll change it. And yes, I'm from Norway.

@Miumau0: Thanks a lot for the edit. It's certainly very pretty, but I'm not so sure about the way you've shaded the robe. After all, the left arm is pretty straight, so the candle is going to be slightly in front of the lady, rather than to the side. For this reason, the candle should cast light on both sides of the robe, and both sleeves, though certainly in varying amounts. I really do like what you've done with the right hand though. Thanks a lot for taking the time to do this! You may see some changes in the way I shade the final version.
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Quote Mr Special Replybullet Posted: 11 September 2011 at 12:04pm
It may just be me, but I feel that her left shoulder should be lowered slightly. I also like the first face of the four you posted in your last version. It looks the most feminine to me due to the eyes. This is a really neat piece btw. Oh, and I like the blue light from the candle better
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Quote CELS Replybullet Posted: 11 September 2011 at 11:00pm
I was planning to finish my work this morning and make use of some of the excellent advice from you guys. Unfortunately, I got up too late and now I have to get going.

Nevertheless, thanks for all your helpful criticism, which I'll try to make use of in the future.

@ Mr Special: You like the slanted eyes better? Well, you may have an asian fetish. There's nothing wrong with that :)
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