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 Topic: Oekaki in the PJ Gallery? |
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sedgemonkey
Admiral 
Joined: 07 April 2021 Online Status: Offline Posts: 1669 |
   Topic: Oekaki in the PJ Gallery?Posted: 28 March 2007 at 11:33am |
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The reason I bring this up is because of the following piece...
To me, sketching with the pencil brush is valid pixel art, but I know that many people feel differently. Edited by sedgemonkey - 28 March 2007 at 11:35am |
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Mirre
Rear Admiral 
Joined: 27 October 2023 Online Status: Offline Posts: 218 |
Posted: 28 March 2007 at 11:49am |
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Tricky question. Technically you can do pixelart with oekaki, and if I remember correcly someone uploaded a mockup or something done in oekaki. But then again, I see pixelart as something where you carefully place each pixel. And in the piece you showed here, that's not exactly what's going on... even if it was done in Paint I'd reconsider having such a piece in the gallry because it looks rushed and unfinished.
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Hapiel
Rear Admiral
Joined: 30 June 2023 Online Status: Offline Posts: 3266 |
Posted: 28 March 2007 at 12:08pm |
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Originally posted by Mirre But then again, I see pixelart as something where you carefully place each pixel. Yeah.. Pixel art is from origine the working from pixel by pixel.. Im not shure what oekaki means, but I know this as Scribbling.. I have done scribbling myself too.. but It doestnt feel like pixel art.. Its completely different from it... |
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jalonso
Admiral
Joined: 29 November 2022 Online Status: Offline Posts: 13537 |
Posted: 28 March 2007 at 1:23pm |
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pixelart - Oekaki
apples - oranges |
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Loop
Seaman 
Joined: 04 December 2006 Location: Brazil Online Status: Offline Posts: 17 |
Posted: 28 March 2007 at 2:25pm |
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Can you post the piece that was submited so we can take a look?
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The B.O.B.
Commander 
Joined: 07 April 2021 Online Status: Offline Posts: 461 |
Posted: 28 March 2007 at 2:44pm |
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I think that Pixel art is Pixel art, and Oekaki is Oekaki. And seeing as how this place is called Pixeljoint, I'd rather only Pixel art be submitted here. However, if there was a special side system/site or gallery especially made for Oekaki, then it wouldn't be much of a problem. In fact, I would just hope that there can be a separation of the two, for organizational purposes. The only issue I see with that, is it would be the first step in this place turning into Deviantart. That would really, really suck.
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Marina
Seaman
Joined: 11 August 2014 Online Status: Offline Posts: 21 |
Posted: 28 March 2007 at 2:48pm |
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Hello everybody
I am the author of this work. I am a Spanish girl, and I dont know to speak English, is a little difficult my to understand it. I come to request excuses publicly if I have done something badly I read the norms, I don't know that to draw with pencil in paint to pothooks is not pixel-art, but I little experienced in pixelart, many of you have more experience in the art of the pixel. I do not try to change nothing norm :P Sorry for the annoyances, and also you excuse my badly English Greetings! Edited by Marina - 28 March 2007 at 2:55pm |
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Ensellitis
Commander
Joined: 19 June 2005 Online Status: Offline Posts: 10099 |
Posted: 28 March 2007 at 5:55pm |
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pixel art is the careful placement and manipulation of each and every pixel. when doing oekaki, you dont have that control.
think of it in another medium... if you were getting a tattoo, would you prefer someone who paid attention to each and every stroke, or would you prefer them to sketch it on? like bob said, if we start letting oekaki in the gallery, then this is no longer pixel joint. its the same reason i feel hybrid should never be allowed and why i revise it everytime i see it... once you make an exception with one thing, then you have to do it again later, or else all the noobs start screaming unfair, then we have to make an exception for them, and so on... then before you know it, this place is just another deviantArt. i am already unhappy with the quality of work that some of the other admins have accepted, but if we allow oekaki, i think that would push me over the edge. this place should stay pure. stay about the pixel art and about the quality. |
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There's a pubic hair on my keyboard. What the f**k?? I "mow the lawn" so it's not mine. Gross. |
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Pixel_Outlaw
Commander
Joined: 01 September 2005 Online Status: Offline Posts: 3829 |
Posted: 28 March 2007 at 10:26pm |
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I'm going to get shot for this but for me pixel art is the end result not the process. All I care about are well made low color images. I'm not talking about color reductions with resizing going on however. If you have a tool that can take 10 minutes off your work and you could do the same thing why not use it.
That being said I don't know what this Okie Dokie business is I've tried to google to no avail. Please post an example of this so I can form a valid opinion. Edited by Pixel_Outlaw - 28 March 2007 at 10:26pm |
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Setzer
Commander
Joined: 18 December 2016 Location: United States Online Status: Offline Posts: 780 |
Posted: 28 March 2007 at 10:51pm |
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To me, oekaki is just unrefined pixel art, and looks really sketchy and not so good. It doesn't take much effort to clean up some lines and make most oekaki look better with touchups, and if the artists do that then we won't know the difference
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Ensellitis
Commander
Joined: 19 June 2005 Online Status: Offline Posts: 10099 |
Posted: 28 March 2007 at 11:34pm |
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Originally posted by Pixel_Outlaw I'm going to get shot for this but for me pixel art is the end result not the process. All I care about are well made low color images. I'm not talking about color reductions with resizing going on however. If you have a tool that can take 10 minutes off your work and you could do the same thing why not use it. That being said I don't know what this Okie Dokie business is I've tried to google to no avail. Please post an example of this so I can form a valid opinion. there is a link in the first post. and as far as your logic goes, a color redux is pixel art, since the end result can be a nice low color image Edited by Ensellitis - 28 March 2007 at 11:34pm |
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There's a pubic hair on my keyboard. What the f**k?? I "mow the lawn" so it's not mine. Gross. |
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Marina
Seaman
Joined: 11 August 2014 Online Status: Offline Posts: 21 |
Posted: 29 March 2007 at 7:20am |
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To seeing
.. I will clarify on my part once again, that my case was an error that I had for
lack of knowledge on having differentiated a style or other. He was not
knowing that the work that I presented was an oekaki, since I thought that, on
having talked each other about a drawing done with the pencil of the MSpaint,
with hatchings planned by means of scrawls and with 27 colors, a pixel might be
art, only than with a "dirty" style. I already apologized, because i didn't know it as i said before, but nobody is born knowing. I agree that the page continues his ideology of the loyalty to the pixel art, i didn't complain for it because I am not even the owner, the rules that everybody has to follow and respect don't bother me at all, I am not going to ask anybody to change anything, even though, I can erase right now the work of my gallery, thing that if I did not do it yesterday, is because it puts me: " PIXEL ART REQUIRES REVISION! ” But I think, there’s no problem at all, if my draw can’t be considerated as pixel art, I’ll erase it from the gallery, and the problem is solved. ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Ok, the
topic of my confusion is clear… Now, entering what Ensellitis says I concern
that what you say that you do not know how the administrators admitted things
of low quality , it seems to Me that a thing is that the page is centered on
the pixel art and nobody should leave of this style; but is different to think
that a work may be excluded because it has a low quality (normally of the
people that begins in the pixel art) so that everything look prettier. About that,
personally I think that it would be very rigid to apply this ideology here,
since while the minimal requisites are fulfilled in the works to pixel, if a
person is beginning in this style, they have all the right to show it, since
precisely they are the people who need more than one opinion of the average drawers
to take experience from them. The
opinions, when they are expressed in a good way, help very much, and we all
without exception have been beginners in this world.. I learned
quite fast thanks to showing my "trash" that i did when y was
beginning in the pixel art world about year ago and a half, so i was been
advised by experienced and humble people, it helped me very much and I learned
quickly (I still have a lot to learn). That's why
I think that everybody has right to show their work, to say and to receive
opinions, any time they are constructive and nobody forgets to respect the
others. Once again,
forgive for the inconveniences that I can have caused, but speaking is the only
way we can understand each others. Greetings
to all PD: This
time I decided to have an english translation, I preferred it this way so that
you can understand what i'm trying to say and you wouldn't be confused or
misunderstood anything, as I said what i thought being as clear as i could with
respect and it scares me that someone could take it badly. |
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PixelSnader
Commander
Not a troll! Joined: 05 June 2014 Online Status: Offline Posts: 3194 |
Posted: 29 March 2007 at 8:01am |
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Originally posted by Marina
I concern that what you say that you do not know how the administrators admitted things of low quality , it seems to Me that a thing is that the page is centered on the pixel art and nobody should leave of this style; but is different to think that a work may be excluded because it has a low quality (normally of the people that begins in the pixel art) so that everything look prettier. every person can post images in work in progress (WIP) forum for help. Gallery is made for beautiful stuff (like real art gallery) so there should be check on quality.
when new with pixel art, learn in forum, then later go to gallery and post.
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Pixel_Outlaw
Commander
Joined: 01 September 2005 Online Status: Offline Posts: 3829 |
Posted: 29 March 2007 at 8:06am |
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Originally posted by Ensellitis
Originally posted by Pixel_Outlaw I'm going to get shot for this but for me pixel art is the end result not the process. All I care about are well made low color images. I'm not talking about color reductions with resizing going on however. If you have a tool that can take 10 minutes off your work and you could do the same thing why not use it. That being said I don't know what this Okie Dokie business is I've tried to google to no avail. Please post an example of this so I can form a valid opinion. there is a link in the first post. and as far as your logic goes, a color redux is pixel art, since the end result can be a nice low color image I'm saying you can't color redux sampled material such as pictures. If you didn't create the base for the color reduction. The link is worthless, the picture has been deleted. But to be honest I probably do care about the result more than the process. Nobody can tell if you used a line tool for a row pixels rather than 16 pixels in a row placed one by one. Edited by Pixel_Outlaw - 29 March 2007 at 8:11am |
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Ensellitis
Commander
Joined: 19 June 2005 Online Status: Offline Posts: 10099 |
Posted: 29 March 2007 at 9:13am |
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there is a difference between using a line tool to make a line and sketching out an entire piece with the line tool and calling it done.
this is the piece in question:  in my opinion, even if we accept oekaki, i would still revise it because in all honesty, it looks like crap anyways. |
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There's a pubic hair on my keyboard. What the f**k?? I "mow the lawn" so it's not mine. Gross. |
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PixelSnader
Commander
Not a troll! Joined: 05 June 2014 Online Status: Offline Posts: 3194 |
Posted: 29 March 2007 at 10:56am |
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that amount of detail could be achieved in 64x64
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Aleiav
Commander
Joined: 08 April 2016 Online Status: Offline Posts: 2380 |
Posted: 29 March 2007 at 1:39pm |
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No.
And I will gladly take down any piece of mine that is oekaki-ish. |
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sedgemonkey
Admiral
Joined: 07 April 2021 Online Status: Offline Posts: 1669 |
Posted: 29 March 2007 at 3:14pm |
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Very nice to see everyone's thoughts on this. The case against Oekaki at PJ seems pretty strong so I will defer to the mob.
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Pixel_Outlaw
Commander
Joined: 01 September 2005 Online Status: Offline Posts: 3829 |
Posted: 30 March 2007 at 10:47pm |
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I think it's similar to a Pollock type of approach. Yes it is art it does show feeling but it's not what you would call labor intensive art.
Is it pixel art, yes. Is it labor intensive-no.
I think rather than deeming it npa it should be noted that it isn't very labor intensive. The end result doesn't reflect something you would put a lot of time into. Edited by Pixel_Outlaw - 30 March 2007 at 10:47pm |
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Di0xygen
Commander
Joined: 03 July 2005 Online Status: Offline Posts: 401 |
Posted: 01 April 2007 at 4:34pm |
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I think that time in art is irrelative, only the result is.
If your able to do a masterpeice in 10 sec well its still a masterpeice, even tho someone else made the same thing in 12 hours. jus like dripping or pouring, its not very labor intensive, to make drips, but to give it the result to want is the hard part and thats all there is about art.. no one cares about how you did it, they only want to see what its looking like in the end |
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c==3
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Lawrence
Commander
Joined: 30 June 2005 Online Status: Offline Posts: 481 |
Posted: 01 April 2007 at 4:57pm |
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Originally posted by Di0xygen I think that time in art is irrelative, only the result is. no one cares about how you did it, they only want to see what its looking like in the end There is a plethora of artists for whom the process of making the art is the art itself and the end result is secondary. Take 2005 Turner Prize winner Simon Starling, for example. Edited by Lawrence - 01 April 2007 at 4:58pm |
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Monkey 'o Doom
Commander
Joined: 24 September 2005 Online Status: Offline Posts: 2994 |
Posted: 01 April 2007 at 7:35pm |
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And Di0xygen, consider the story of the king who asked the court artist to paint him a rooster. The artist took over a year and so the king came to his studio, demanding his painting. The artist paints a perfect rooster in 5 minutes and the king is outraged. He demands to know why he did not receive the product sooner. The artist leads him into a back room filled with canvases showing roosters, and he says "it took me a year to learn how to paint a perfect rooster in five minutes." Isn't that a greater feat than an artist spending a year simply painting a rooster? |
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RPG is numberwang. |
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Pixel_Outlaw
Commander
Joined: 01 September 2005 Online Status: Offline Posts: 3829 |
Posted: 01 April 2007 at 8:05pm |
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This is all so stupid. Nobody has been able to define art to satisfy everyone. Hell as far as I'm concerned the whole term "pixel art" has no real meaning. Even placing art pixel by pixel isn't pixel art to many if a relatively large number of colors are used.
-There is no definition of allowed color count
-There is no definition of minimal size
-There is no definition of quality
-There is no deinition of a required complexity level
-There is no definition of subject matter (abstract art is a no no)
People go around pointing fingers and calling names over something they have no concrete definition. I consider myself a pixel artist because I keep the tradition of low color spriting alive.
Art in general is a very open ended concept.
Pixel art tries to place undefined limits on digital art and this makes the problem.
Submittable "pixel art" is defined by a handful of moderators.
If you're going to exclude certain types of art quantifiable rules need to be set into place.
That said I voted no. I just want people to really draw up some RULEs that have concrete meaning. If this can't be done people will still make art that will get rejected.
Basically as it stands the motto seems to be "I can't define pixel art by any quantifiable standards but your art doesn't fit."
I havn't had any art rejected so don't think that I have any grudges.
The biggest gripe with pixel art is that even if each pixel is placed by hand it will still not be pixel art if an imaginary maximum color count is crossed. However you can make an image using a CAD program and if you keep the color count low and nobody can tell it will be submitable pixel art. Edited by Pixel_Outlaw - 01 April 2007 at 8:15pm |
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Metaru
Commander
Joined: 03 February 2020 Online Status: Offline Posts: 3305 |
Posted: 02 April 2007 at 1:46pm |
Pixel artFrom Wikipedia, the free encyclopediaDefinition
Pixel art is distinguished from other forms of digital art by an insistence upon manual, pixel-level editing of an image (without the application of image filters, automatic anti-aliasing or special rendering modes), often at close magnification. In this form, it is commonly said that "each pixel was placed carefully" to achieve a desired result.[citation needed] Purists within the pixel art scene hold that "true" pixel art should only be created from tools that place individual pixels (such as the 'pencil' tool), and that pixel artists should avoid all other tools including line, Bezier curve, circle and rectangle. Others counter that tools such as line and bucket-fill are acceptable as their functions could be just as easily, if not as quickly, replicated on an individual pixel basis.[citation needed] Because of this rule, image filters (such as blurring or alpha-blending) or tools with automatic anti-aliasing are generally considered not valid tools for pixel art, as such tools calculate new pixel values automatically, contrasting against the precise manual arrangement of pixels that is associated with "true" pixel art. Because "true" pixel art is identified by the method of drawing rather than the end result, other digital artwork created without filters or special effects (i.e. using only the 'pencil' tool and the like) are not considered pixel art, and are instead referred to as oekakis. OekakiFrom Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia |
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Pixel_Outlaw
Commander
Joined: 01 September 2005 Online Status: Offline Posts: 3829 |
Posted: 02 April 2007 at 2:52pm |
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Originally posted by Metaru Because "true" pixel art is identified by the method of drawing rather than the end result, This is misleading, color count also plays a role in the submittable works.
(Of course there is no real rule to this it still goes without solid definition)
Any college professor Will tell you Wikipedia is a poor source for reliable information. It's not a scholarly source. Anyone can contribute leading to red herrings and fallacies.
To truly understand original pixel art you would need to work with the limits imposed on the precursors to modern graphics cards. Artists like Setzer do this and they have a better feel for the origins. Pixel art was born out of limitation. They had clearly defined limts such as size and color count. We don't. Some colors cannot co exist in certain screen depths even if something has a low number of colors they might not even be able to be shown in all the same screen depths.
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Akira
Commander
Joined: 03 March 2005 Location: New Zealand Online Status: Offline Posts: 220 |
Posted: 02 April 2007 at 10:14pm |
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By cutting all this lovely almost pixel art out of our diets we are limiting ourselves as artists.
Marina's piece shows much more pixel skill than a lot of works in the gallery currently. I fear that this community is becoming stagnant in it's closemindedness. |
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The B.O.B.
Commander
Joined: 07 April 2021 Online Status: Offline Posts: 461 |
Posted: 02 April 2007 at 10:41pm |
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No one is really saying that Oekaki is horrible crap-ass art (except Ens. Don't stare into his eyes, when he rants. Else you turn into stone. You don't want to know what he does to you afterwards...
 ) I kind of like Oekaki art. Yes, Marina's skill in that piece is pretty good, although sketchy. In my opinion, though, this place is a gallery for pixel art, and pixel art only. True, there is NO actual concrete definition, as individuals choose what they want their art to be in the end. However, I believe at this specific website, the community stresses what our general opinion of pixel art SHOULD be. And to be honest, the increasing amount of talent that have manage to join over the recent months that PJ has been open, is a sure sign that OUR opinion may just in fact, be correct in the subject of pure pixel art(in terms of "Purtyness"...heh, I'm so shallow...). So again, it's not an issue of " we hate all other types of art! Let the Pixel Nazi regime begin!!" It's just an issue of what should be allowed to be what WE consider pixel art as a whole. I don't think we are being close minded, as the internet offers a wide variety of awesome ass digital and traditional art; hell, every artist here gets to use a link to their specific website, to showcase any type of art skills they use. So, there is an equal opportunity for all, in every form of art in my opinion. This website just showcases the specific form of what we believe to be pixel art. That is all. Again, just my opinion... |
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Ensellitis
Commander
Joined: 19 June 2005 Online Status: Offline Posts: 10099 |
Posted: 03 April 2007 at 3:48am |
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Originally posted by Akira By cutting all this lovely almost pixel art out of our diets we are limiting ourselves as artists. Marina's piece shows much more pixel skill than a lot of works in the gallery currently. I fear that this community is becoming stagnant in it's closemindedness. close minded? you said it yourself, ALMOST pixel art. which makes it not pixel art. there are a few times i have to open my vector up and do an hour or so of single pixel manipulation, doesnt that make it almost pixel art? |
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There's a pubic hair on my keyboard. What the f**k?? I "mow the lawn" so it's not mine. Gross. |
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Skull
Commander
PJ Pioneer Joined: 03 August 2019 Online Status: Offline Posts: 1521 |
Posted: 03 April 2007 at 4:40am |
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Just because one works with pixels, don't make it pixel art.
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Metaru
Commander
Joined: 03 February 2020 Online Status: Offline Posts: 3305 |
Posted: 03 April 2007 at 12:37pm |
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Originally posted by Pixel_Outlaw
Originally posted by Metaru Because "true" pixel art is identified by the method of drawing rather than the end result, This is misleading, color count also plays a role in the submittable works.
(Of course there is no real rule to this it still goes without solid definition)
Any college professor Will tell you Wikipedia is a poor source for reliable information. It's not a scholarly source. Anyone can contribute leading to red herrings and fallacies.
well, such definition was given only as a reference. anyone who read this already knows that a definition for what "is" or "supposed to be" Pixel Art hasn't been written. ---
Hmm... that's true. origins of Pixel Art are linked with the very begginings of graphic cards and old videogames. but, that doesn't mean that pixel Art nowdays follos such limitations. in fact, i wouldn't call it "limitations" itself.
let's see.
if i use pencils to draw, it's traditional art.
if I use paint, is a painting.
now, if i use pixels, it's a pixel art? no... is way more complex than that. surely you can make drawings in MS paint, but do not expec to be considered as pixel art by someone who actually takes 4 or 5 hours to patiently draw each pixel of their work, checks if the saturations is ok, sets frames, manually AA, etc.... ok, maybe there's people who can do it in less than 4 or 5 hours, but i think its, indeed, a combination of result and process. both make in the end, what can be "considered" as pixel art.
hmmm... this thread still needs more discussion. Edited by Metaru - 04 April 2007 at 7:31am |
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I ate leel's babies
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Akira
Commander
Joined: 03 March 2005 Location: New Zealand Online Status: Offline Posts: 220 |
Posted: 04 April 2007 at 3:10am |
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heheh. i knew someone would pick up on almost pixel art.
but meh. i knew i wasn't going to change anybodys mind about it. just getting my opinion out there so my opinion is out there (don't you hate it when people do that?) |
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OMGFossil
Commander
Joined: 03 June 2005 Online Status: Offline Posts: 948 |
Posted: 04 April 2007 at 3:14am |
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its pixel art
i wish you guys didnt make it seem more complex than it actually is |
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no siggy
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Ensellitis
Commander
Joined: 19 June 2005 Online Status: Offline Posts: 10099 |
Posted: 04 April 2007 at 4:49am |
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its not complex, its a mixture of opinions that differ.
oekaki will never be pixel art in my eyes, and i will continue to send them back for revision. |
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There's a pubic hair on my keyboard. What the f**k?? I "mow the lawn" so it's not mine. Gross. |
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Pixel_Outlaw
Commander
Joined: 01 September 2005 Online Status: Offline Posts: 3829 |
Posted: 04 April 2007 at 8:14am |
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Refined Oekaki would be pixel art then correct?
I'm just trying to understand where you are coming form. Many people start with an oekaki type outline and fill for images. Edited by Pixel_Outlaw - 04 April 2007 at 8:14am |
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Metaru
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Joined: 03 February 2020 Online Status: Offline Posts: 3305 |
Posted: 04 April 2007 at 10:46pm |
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lets understand Oekaki then, as:
"A form of drawing that borns as a dinamic option in a Forum, where things like imprecision of the lines or the use of AA tools are allowed and/or common. Nature of Oekaki is, in fact, Sketching" |
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I ate leel's babies
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pixelblink
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Joined: 19 February 2023 Online Status: Offline Posts: 2865 |
Posted: 04 April 2007 at 11:00pm |
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Originally posted by Metaru I don't think it's a good idea to put Pixel Art 'over' Oekaki. both are valid as forms of expresion. I don't think anyone here is saying it isn't. That's like saying we put pixel art over pencil sketches or painting or anything else. We don't. We just consider this a place for pixel art only. We (most of us) are just trying to say it isn't pixel art just because it was sketched it out with pixels. Edited by pixelblink - 04 April 2007 at 11:00pm |
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PixelSnader
Commander
Not a troll! Joined: 05 June 2014 Online Status: Offline Posts: 3194 |
Posted: 05 April 2007 at 2:08am |
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the program you use doesnt matter. its the amount of attention you put in it.
http://pixeljoint.com/pixelart/14710.htm# this absolutely qualifies as pixel art, because there is a lot of attention paid to individual pixels
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Pixel_Outlaw
Commander
Joined: 01 September 2005 Online Status: Offline Posts: 3829 |
Posted: 05 April 2007 at 1:57pm |
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I agree. The misuse of the term is the only thing causing this problem. I say refer to my hammer as a Craftsman. Craftsman made it so it is a Craftsman, not a hammer. If a Craftsman is made by any other process not used specifically by Craftsman or other style than my Craftsman it is not a Craftsman.
So hammer=raster image with pixel art parameters
craftsman = type of hammer
A hammer is a hammer providing it has essential parts such as a head and handle, not just Craftsman made hammers. The same should go for pixel art.
The program of origin is meaningless. It would be like calling images done in photoshops Photoshops and then banning images from that program.
Jalonso now makes Photoshops. I make MS Paints.
Photoshop has the ability to make non pixel art raster images. Jalonso should now be banned for using NPA for an entire gallery and refusing to use a pixel art program that doesn't support filters and other NPA effects. Edited by Pixel_Outlaw - 05 April 2007 at 2:08pm |
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Metaru
Commander
Joined: 03 February 2020 Online Status: Offline Posts: 3305 |
Posted: 05 April 2007 at 10:31pm |
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Then, Metaru go to check it by himself and made an Oekaki. and, ironically, I agree with Ensellitis.
so, here's my final veredict/tesis and opinion: Pixel Art is made with care, time, patience and precision, PIXEL BY PIXEL FROM THE GROUND UP. born in the very early days of graphic aplications, games, OS, etc, where only the ability of the artist to sucessful obtain the desired image counts, like the old photographers before the invasion of Digital Cameras. In a Pixel Art, a dedicated software could be a help, but the quality and final result of the pixel art itself depends only of the ability of the artist, as mentioned before, and that's where Pixel Art power resides. Oekaki is another diferent thing, born of a Java aplication so anime/manga fans could easily make Fan Arts and/or drawings while they interact in the respective forum. in its beginings, Oekaki programs where only MS paints 'emulators' for forums, but today they allow the use of Antialiased tools, blur efects, like any other program like Photoshop. An Oekaki's final result depends then from both the artist and the program where he makes the Oekaki(go and check it by yourself in any of the thousand Oekaki dedicated sites arround the net) - Now, to the original issue of the thread: is Marina's submission a valid pixel Art?  I will say no. Why: she had the skill to make that, and that's ok. it could take her ten minutes or ten hours to make it, that's doesn't really matter. but, where is the dedication? the care of the final result? a true pixel artist know that a huge image isn't needed to make such drawing, the saturation, the color balances, the color reductions, ligth sources, the proper selout, adding textures, the AA if needed, the details, the damn wrong details that keeps ruining your damn work making you feel frustrated because the damn deadline is in 10 minutes, salt, pepper, and way more aspects and things that a former Pixel Artist knows and applies(or learns to apply(or suffers while apliying(or unable to apply))) to his/her artwork in order to achieve his goals. not a bunch of random lines. Period. god nigth everyone, and god bless the pixel art for his own pixel sake. - grammar revisions for this text would be very apreciated. |
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I ate leel's babies
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OMGFossil
Commander
Joined: 03 June 2005 Online Status: Offline Posts: 948 |
Posted: 06 April 2007 at 9:40pm |
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this entire discussion is dumb
Edited by OMGFossil - 06 April 2007 at 9:42pm |
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no siggy
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OMGFossil
Commander
Joined: 03 June 2005 Online Status: Offline Posts: 948 |
Posted: 07 April 2007 at 11:07pm |
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ensellitis did you just reject cyanfire's oekaki because that work seemed to me that it was worthy of being called pixel art
  what do you guys think oh yes go ahead reject this work it seems like something done quick and easy and is in a different style to what we see of most pixel arts who needs oekaki when we have LIL DUDES anyway  Edited by OMGFossil - 07 April 2007 at 11:27pm |
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no siggy
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Marina
Seaman
Joined: 11 August 2014 Online Status: Offline Posts: 21 |
Posted: 10 April 2007 at 8:03am |
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Metaru you don't know whether this took me 10 min, or 10 hours. Actually,
it took me an hour and a half (this picture is create with the mouse)... like many other works I've made, which
have taken me half an hour, an entire hour, and some of them even 7
hours, as much as a hand drawing! Everything is relative depending upon
what style you use, which size you pick, and the amount of detail you
want to go with.
Taking your definition of pixel art into account, why is it considered pixel art a drawing that is only lineart and color, and lacks any shadows or detail? I am questioning this because I've seen many similar works also considered as pixel art... Wasn't pixel art the art of carefully creating details by placing each pixel individually? Truly... I am confused with so much contradiction going on. And with that I'm not saying whether this work, which is still being questioned, is a pixel art or an oekaki. Actually, after reading so many comments, opinions and ideas, I've lost track of what oekaki is, so let it be an oekaki and case closed. Now I reply: The fact that I DON'T KNOW the EXACT term that differentiates pixel art from Oekakis, makes me an ignorant compared to someone from this community? Everyone is (or has been, for that matter) an ignorant at some point, just like I was unaware of the difference between both styles, as I wrote in my last message. I'd like not to be judged by this limitation, or be questioned whether I have or not the skills to do something; not when they don't know me at all. This has all ended in prejudice, hence we must watch out what we write when posting. If a TRUE artist knows all of that you tallk about, does that make me a FALSE artist? because in that case, I'd like to kneel down upon them for KNOWING SO MUCH without taking into account that they had to learn all that first... just like me. That's why I think that I am a true artist as much as any other, even if I'm just starting out. I know unlike many, that I have been doing this for a year and a half already (and getting paid for it for 15 months), and even if it's not much compared to others around here, I do not want to be judged just because I made a slight mistake. It wasn't my intention to reply any more in this topic after my last message, but after reading certain things I have found myself forced to write this to straighten things out. I made it clear that if my work is not considered pixel art, then it's as simple as deleting it and get over with it. You have repeated many times already the definition of each style, so it's pointless to go on with this topic. I'm done with what I had to say. Have a nice day, everybody. |
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El Moppo
Seaman
Joined: 01 September 2006 Online Status: Offline Posts: 14 |
Posted: 10 April 2007 at 1:13pm |
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Art is art. This is all digital here. So why can't Pixel Joint be about the Pixel Art and welcome the Oekaki as well? Just not be an Oekaki site? Ya see, all ya have to do is have a small side section for Oekaki and keep the big huge section for Pixel Joint. Or, make a sibling site called "Scribble Joint"...Edited by El Moppo - 10 April 2007 at 1:13pm |
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Ensellitis
Commander
Joined: 19 June 2005 Online Status: Offline Posts: 10099 |
Posted: 10 April 2007 at 8:15pm |
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Originally posted by El Moppo Art is art. This is all digital here. So why can't Pixel Joint be about the Pixel Art and welcome the Oekaki as well? please tell me you just had a brain fart... now, omg... yes, i did reject it, why? because it isnt pixel art. i will continue to reject it, i refuse to see this place become another deviantArt. the day that happens, i will leave pj. and calling this discussion dumb as an argument makes me take your opinion less to mind. you arent helping your argument one little bit. oekaki is a sketch, not pixel art. i stand by my decision, and always will. if you think im such a horrible person/admin, then fine... let the other admins know, and if they agree, i will step down from my position willingly and leave pj so i can remember it for what it was instead of a place allowing non pixel art and oekaki into a site dedicated to showcasing the best pixel art there is to offer. you all are trying to take 2 forms of art and classify them together. if this was OilPaintJoint, would you allow pencil sketches in? i doubt it. if you bought a bag of apples at the store, and the bag had a bunch of oranges in it, would you say "same thing, they are both fruit"? once again, i doubt it very much. |
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There's a pubic hair on my keyboard. What the f**k?? I "mow the lawn" so it's not mine. Gross. |
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Setzer
Commander
Joined: 18 December 2016 Location: United States Online Status: Offline Posts: 780 |
Posted: 11 April 2007 at 9:57am |
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you guys know theres always deviantart and those other sites right
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Larwick
Commander
Joined: 18 July 2024 Online Status: Offline Posts: 4015 |
Posted: 13 April 2007 at 4:02pm |
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In the end this has nothing about definitions of Pixel Art of Oekaki, it's about what PixelJoint itself will allow into its gallery. We have to have boundaries, and this is one of them. I think the 'Oekaki' work shown in this thread is great, but why fight to have it in the gallery here? You can put it on deviant art, or a thread in the forums instead. We have to draw the line somewhere.
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jalonso
Admiral
Joined: 29 November 2022 Online Status: Offline Posts: 13537 |
Posted: 13 April 2007 at 6:17pm |
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Now that's the point clearly stated. Larwick don't leave us for so long again, k.
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Metaru
Commander
Joined: 03 February 2020 Online Status: Offline Posts: 3305 |
Posted: 13 April 2007 at 6:43pm |
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why marina... why you misundertood me at that level... =_=
ok, i'm done with this discussion... |
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I ate leel's babies
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Ensellitis
Commander
Joined: 19 June 2005 Online Status: Offline Posts: 10099 |
Posted: 13 April 2007 at 7:05pm |
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31-7, so the decision is pretty much obvious anyways
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There's a pubic hair on my keyboard. What the f**k?? I "mow the lawn" so it's not mine. Gross. |
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Feron
Midshipman 
Joined: 17 September 2006 Online Status: Offline Posts: 99 |
Posted: 15 April 2007 at 8:00am |
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if u add an oekaki section then it will just get flooded with sh*t, and people will say its there style.
tbh i dont think the piece in question is that bad, good color choice, quite cool design. allowing oekaki into the gallery would be like allowing one of picasso's childhood drawings into an art gallery. |
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hmmmm.
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